Zombie HORDE - The mappack project! (11 / r27) 14/12/2015

[Stiff]

So in fact devpack is testpack for testpack?
Right

Anyway we will see.

[Xsnake]

Alright, I read all your posts and I will clarify some points.

● I don't intend to leave the "mod core" lead to anyone, that is to say, everything that's in relation with the ZH-betas wads. I'm gonna be honest : I just don't know who I could give this lead to. Sorry Fused. It's not that I don't trust you, but I don't want to do something I might regret in the future.
That's how it is. I'm attached to this mod and I would be annoyed to see it has become something I don't like.

That being said, it was always exciting to see some custom stuff/addon like zh-duel, smoothweapons, etc... So, I guess the idea would be to finalize the core wad (once and for all) so that whoever wants to work on an addon of the mod doesn't have to worry about compatibility problems.

● As for the mappack/testpack, I was hoping Rabbit could help me out with them but it seems he's been busy too. I can't blame him for that. So I guess I will put someone else in charge for the testpacks in order to do some filtering and not have loads of wads to host on the server.

... there are still a truckload of issues with ZH itself.

Could you elaborate ? I know about the balacing issues, but what else is there to fix, as far as you're concerned ?

[Fused]

No problem, i can fully understand that.
As for the available spot, i wouln't mind taking care of the map and testpacks instead.

[ibm5155]

/\ lol...

well so no zombie horde 2, just some person to take care of mappack and testpack ... (and maybe another ones to fix things if they're needed)

\/ That's another thing that I may put on my debug script, check how many times does humans lose or win...
at least, with the already done code, I could fix the ghoul balance, to make it just a "rare" effect

[Stiff]

Nah testpacks wont be a problem, I would like to help too...

I have no idea about the balance but regarding to serverstats:
ZM: 50% win both
ZE: 70% win zombies

[Untitled]

Yeah, ZM's are about even; ZE's I found zombies win the majority of the time, and even with that, the majority of human wins are just locking down the start zombie at 15 humans (hence why humans lose at 17+ players where there's two start zombies).

Honestly, ZE maps I'd say are harder to balance. More factors to consider. It shows.

I remember making rather verbose advice about the maps a whole whack of pages ago.

EDIT: Well some of the map-specific advice is out of date but my general ideas are not:
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 8#pid43188
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 0#pid43330
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 9#pid48259
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 9#pid48311
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 1#pid48701
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 2#pid49488
http://zandronum.com/forum/showthread.p ... 8#pid49513

[Fused]

Here's an update, possibly one of the finals.

http://[bad site]/download?file=fuse ... cepack.wad

- Decreased the possibility to telefrag yourself at the zombie spawn.
- Aligned unaligned walls.

http://[bad site]/download?file=ze21finalv1.7.wad

//ZE29betaV1.1 -> ZE29betaV1.2
- Moved 3 magma particle spawners at the thirth resist. They were misplaced.
- Secret ending finished for the most part (only the script bug is left)
- Added a script that brights the map up for software players.
- Resists 2 and 3 are shorter.
- Compiled script 10 with the actual script.
- Listed unused scripts on top.
- Differend voice acting at final ending.
- Rebalanced resist 2 and 5.
- Remade zombie spawn and made it open 6 seconds after the zombie is being chosen.
- Added ai script for experiment.
- Added 3d modelled trees, stalagmites and stalagtites for extra effect.
- Removed floor_lower/raisebyvalue from the vans since they dont work with clientside scripts anyway.
- Fixed some texture aligning in the vents.
- Hidden most 3d floor dummy sectors.
- Placed missing -actor hits floor- actors in the big lava bridge room.
- Placed a jacks gun ontop of the waterfall after the collapsing mine tunnel part.
- Organised most scripts a bit.

//ZE29betaV1.2 -> ZE29betaV1.2b
- Added sounds for the lava.
- (Hopefully) removed all homs that i forgot in ZE29betaV1.2.
- Added some overall detail on the map.
- Added new water particle spawner.
- Fixed experiment.
- Added the feature of seeing the whole map.
- Added no falldamage on a teleportation spot to prevent player from taking too much damage.
- Changed the final resist voice (again) (this time it is good)

http://[bad site]/download?file=ze29betav1.2b.wad

EDIT: It appears i made some mistakes.

In Canyon Run it looks like UDMF played with my map a little, so a door was misaligned and a rails had the wrong texture. Way to go UDMF.
People also get authentication failure, because i used that version in public multiplayer testing.
http://[bad site]/download?file=ze29betav1.2c.wad

Also the resourcepack was outdated, but that was just a sound, but it's terribly timed now. Here's a fix too, i decided to name these by versions too by the way:
http://[bad site]/download?file=fuse ... ckv1.1.wad

[Xsnake]

Alright, Fused and stiff, you guys are in charge of the testpacks (not the mappacks).

Here is a short list of things that need to be checked for each *new* map before sending a testpack to Konar :
-the 32 player starts are there
-the "game will start in 10/30 seconds" is there, proving that the ACS is working
-there is a reasonable amount of bonus items in the map
-team damage is forced to 1.0 in the mapinfo
-make sure there is no decorate numbers collision with items from the core/mappack (this happened for ZE23). If there is a collision, it should be printed in the console, soon after the wads are loaded.
-the zombie teleports (500 & 501) are there

Hopefully, putting two people in charge won't be a problem. So please communicate before releasing a new testpack.

If anyone else wants to help, I need to check if the zh-duel and zh-smoothweapons are still compatible with the current beta. Otherwise I'll do it myself this weekend.

[Fused]

So i've had a chat with Stiff a while ago about the maps, and what has to be fixed. Here is a bit of a list on that we discussed on.

[spoiler]-ZE17 - the Good, the Bad and the Ugly - Blood
I asked blood if it was possible to fix the lag at the end of the map. I also asked if he could fix the really bad balance that this map has. He told me that he didn't care anymore and by that he wouldnt fix it. He was fine with it being removed. I will ask him if maybe i could fix the map, otherwise we might have to consider removing it.'

-ZE21 - Colossus - Fused
Since it's my own map i can't really say anything about it. I feel like i have proper balance on this, since i see both humans as zombies win in an even percentage. If somebody thinks otherwise, i'm open for critism.

-ZE23 - Byelomorye Dam - Niiro Kitsune
So according to people this is one big Goldeneye ripoff with some added 3d floor. I never really got into playing Goldeneye, so i can't confirm it at this time. If somebody has proof, i'm glad to see it. Apart from that, the balance on this map is really bad. None of the resists are defendable, except for a small block at the second resist (that opens way too soon anyway). Apart from that you can only defend yourself with an overdose of grenades really.

ZE26 - Scarlet's Castle - Blood
The thing with this map is that it's very boring. Mainly because it uses marble way too much. The map also uses alot of copy-pasted sectors.
Apart from that the map's balance is about fine. Partly because there is an overdose of grenades probably.

There are 2 secret endings, both at each side. I think these secret endings are WAY TOO EASY to activate. The ending at the left gate is also pretty bad due to the long walk you have to make in the short time. As said with ZE17 i'm sure nothing of this will be fixed.

ZE27 - Lava Temple - Stiff
Due to it bein a very big and dynamic map, lots of people can't find their way throughg it. I've seen lots of people say they can't find out where to go. Apart from that the map should get some serious software support. I tried playing this map a few times on software mode, and it was very dark and difficult to navigate. The skybox was also one big HOM.

ZE29 - Canyon Run - Fused
Again, my map so i'm not sure what to do about it. I know the balance was pretty bad, and i'm not sure how it is now. I haven't seen it with 5+ people yet, so i will have to see that first.

ZM09 - Abandoned Mines - IBM5155
I honestly haven't played this map in a while, so i'm not 100% about everything. It's a nice map, but i think the ghouldemon should really be nerfed. Last time i played the ghouldemon attacked me while i was a zombie, and it killed me in like 6 seconds when i was full health.

Apart from that i think the map is fine as it is. (Maybe a bit too many features?)

ZM14 - Jailbreak pt 2 - Stiff
The map is nice and big, i'm not really sure what to say about it. Maybe script the lockpick to take a while before it can open the door you wanted to open.[/spoiler]

These are Stiff's and mine 2 cents. If somebody has to add or correct anything, please say so.

[Stiff]

Ask blood if I can edit Ze17 abit (I don't say that it will be a succes).
Maybe I can fix some problems and lag issues.

Also, adding cityscape by mspark is a good idea in my eyes.
It has everything what XSnake asked, the detail is quite bad but that can be fixed in the future and the gameplay is good as long as I remember.

Edit:

This dude wanted to make a zh map and he has a mapslot reserved, as you can see on the image it's a long time ago that he was online, soooo what to do with him? :/

[Fused]

Same to Dr.Robotnik, Lyra, Coffeescripter and Hellhawk x. I can ask Robotnik and Hellhawk how theirs is going, but i haven't seen the other 2 anymore.

EDIT: I just got word from blood that it's ok if i edit his maps.

EDIT 2: So i made a little list real quick for ze17 that i will utilise when i'm home from work. I might add more stuff, but for now this is it:

Code: Select all

-Fix the current bad quality music
-Redo the ending.
-Add overall detail that wont lag the map
-Fix balance
-Change the way the level plays.

@stiff, could you do ZE26 maybe?

[Stiff]

Eh... That map is ways bigger than ze17... I don‘t have that much time.

[ibm5155]

just please, make a testpack, and not a salad wad to be downloaded on servers :s
I still remember the last time where there were a salad wad on zombie horde servers, I couldn't even play the demos of it because it had more than 255 chars
D:

EDIT:last time I made soulsphere to take 300 or 200 hp from zombies and 4 hp from humans, I one or other way the zombie will die at the end, but I can make it kill zombies only when there's a few humans
ex:
3 humans, 1 zombie: kill 2 humans then kill a zombie
5 humans, 3 zombies: kill 3 humans and 3 zombies or 5 humans and 2 zombies

[Untitled]

So i've had a chat with Stiff a while ago about the maps, and what has to be fixed. Here is a bit of a list on that we discussed on.

-ZE17 - the Good, the Bad and the Ugly - Blood
I asked blood if it was possible to fix the lag at the end of the map. I also asked if he could fix the really bad balance that this map has. He told me that he didn't care anymore and by that he wouldnt fix it. He was fine with it being removed. I will ask him if maybe i could fix the map, otherwise we might have to consider removing it.'

Eh, I actually find the map fun - in larger player counts (20+, which I almost exclusively play at), it's fun.

-ZE21 - Colossus - Fused
Since it's my own map i can't really say anything about it. I feel like i have proper balance on this, since i see both humans as zombies win in an even percentage. If somebody thinks otherwise, i'm open for critism.

I've found that humans tend to win in lower player counts (the map set up means that even if there's more humans to shoot back, there's not much you can do at 10 zombies), and that zombies tend to win in higher player counts, which I see more often. It balances out in a way, but eh.

-ZE23 - Byelomorye Dam - Niiro Kitsune
So according to people this is one big Goldeneye ripoff with some added 3d floor. I never really got into playing Goldeneye, so i can't confirm it at this time. If somebody has proof, i'm glad to see it. Apart from that, the balance on this map is really bad. None of the resists are defendable, except for a small block at the second resist (that opens way too soon anyway). Apart from that you can only defend yourself with an overdose of grenades really.

My thoughts exactly.

ZE26 - Scarlet's Castle - Blood
The thing with this map is that it's very boring. Mainly because it uses marble way too much. The map also uses alot of copy-pasted sectors.
Apart from that the map's balance is about fine. Partly because there is an overdose of grenades probably.

There are 2 secret endings, both at each side. I think these secret endings are WAY TOO EASY to activate. The ending at the left gate is also pretty bad due to the long walk you have to make in the short time. As said with ZE17 i'm sure nothing of this will be fixed.

Pretty much. The secret endings are too easy to activate (I pretty much always see them activated), and this map could use an aesthetic touch-up, but otherwise it could be a really great map.

ZE27 - Lava Temple - Stiff
Due to it bein a very big and dynamic map, lots of people can't find their way throughg it. I've seen lots of people say they can't find out where to go. Apart from that the map should get some serious software support. I tried playing this map a few times on software mode, and it was very dark and difficult to navigate. The skybox was also one big HOM.

Yeah, it really needs some arrows pointing where to go - when I first played the map, I got lost a bunch of times. Really nice map though.

ZE29 - Canyon Run - Fused
Again, my map so i'm not sure what to do about it. I know the balance was pretty bad, and i'm not sure how it is now. I haven't seen it with 5+ people yet, so i will have to see that first.

I haven't played enough, but the map seemed pretty fun (aside from the fact I can't keep zombies out of last resist, but eh it's a large room, and I actually died fighting the humans there, so eh).

ZM09 - Abandoned Mines - IBM5155
I honestly haven't played this map in a while, so i'm not 100% about everything. It's a nice map, but i think the ghouldemon should really be nerfed. Last time i played the ghouldemon attacked me while i was a zombie, and it killed me in like 6 seconds when i was full health.

Apart from that i think the map is fine as it is. (Maybe a bit too many features?)

Eh, could be Uboa.

ZM14 - Jailbreak pt 2 - Stiff
The map is nice and big, i'm not really sure what to say about it. Maybe script the lockpick to take a while before it can open the door you wanted to open.

Dunno what to say about the map. Seems nice.

These are Stiff's and mine 2 cents. If somebody has to add or correct anything, please say so.

Nice feedback. These are exactly the kind of comments that I would guess developers need (at least, talking from my own experiences).

[fr blood]

Fused and Stiff, I would like you to remove ZE26, I know that I'll be bored sometimes in my holydays (1~2 months laters) and then I'll probably make an update by reading all things that you gave me, good luck with the project.

[Fused]

I have a few things.
First of all i must inform you Blood. The Grandvoid Zombie Horde servers have crashed twice in a row now as soon as ZE26 started. I'm unsure why this is happening, and it hasn't happened before. Since the map will be removed soon as requested anyway, this will be nothing major. But please try to find what causes this, and if this is a map problem please try to fix it.

Second of all, Dr. Robotnik has given his map to me. He told me he wasn't motivated anymore to map. The map progress seems very far already, but i only checked it through slade so far. The map is around 9mb, but the music is still MP3. I might consider finishing it, but if that happends, i will finish my other maps first.

Lastly some information about testpack r_18. I am planning to release testpack r_18 when either me or Vincent finished mapping. Vincent told me he could finish the map this week. In case he is unable to finish it anytime soon, i will release r_18 when my update of ZE17 is done. Of course, when we are both done at almost the same time, it both gets added.

EDIT: Nevermind what i said there blood. It seems like there is a bug in the server itself.

EDIT2: The problem of ZE26 crashing has been fixed.

[Vincent(PDP)]

Lastly some information about testpack r_18. I am planning to release testpack r_18 when either me or Vincent finished mapping. Vincent told me he could finish the map this week. In case he is unable to finish it anytime soon, i will release r_18 when my update of ZE17 is done. Of course, when we are both done at almost the same time, it both gets added.

Yes, I'm back in action. Using all the time I can to build, bugfix and stylize ZM10.

So far I've fixed some telefragging spots (not all though), map bugs, ACS bugs etc.

---

Since there's lot's of telefrag on some ZH maps I give you all this:

Visual Vincent's easy guide on how to prevent telefrag on your multiplayer Zandronum maps!

- To do this you need to know how to script in ACS. Click here to read more about ACS.

If there's enough space, place 32 teleport destinations in the spot(s) to teleport to, and give them a tag range like for example 400-431. It's important that it goes in a range... So that it's not that some destinations for example have the tags 424, 355, 389, 506.

THE TAGS CANNOT BE 500, 501 OR 600-631 SINCE THEY'RE USED BY THE ZOMBIE HORDE CORE MOD!

Then to teleport the players there you gotta use ACS.
Create this script

Code: Select all

Script <number here> (void)
{
Teleport(400+PlayerNumber(), 0, 0);
}

Note that the 400 in 400+PlayerNumber() is the lowest tag of all of your 32 teleport destinations.

Now put action 80 (ACS Execute) on your activation line/thing and set the script number to the number you wrote in <number here>.

There. If you follow those two steps there will be no telefrag in that/those sector(s).


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


To save the amount of scripts used to teleport, you can use a thing called a Switch Block. It allows you to execute different things from the same script. Read more

This is how you build it:

Code: Select all

Script <number here> (Int x)
{
    Switch(x)
    {
      Case 0:
        Teleport(400+PlayerNumber(), 0, 0);
      Break;

      Case 1:
        Teleport(700+PlayerNumber(), 0, 0);
      Break;
    }
}

The 0 and 1 blocks are executed depending on what the input variable x is set to. If x is set to 0 it executes everything within the text Case 0: and Break;... Same thing goes for 1 and so on. You don't have to set them to 0 or 1 you can set them to 8, 13, 145 or whatever you want.

Now to set the x variable from an activating line/thing you select the action 80 (ACS Execute) and set the script number to the number you put instead of <number here>. You will see some other boxes too: "Map number" and "Argument 1-3"... The x variable is set by putting a number in "Argument 1". So if you put '1' in "Argument 1" it will execute the case block number 1. So in my script it will execute this line:

Code: Select all

Teleport(700+PlayerNumber(), 0, 0);

Hope this helps!

[ibm5155]

32 teleports O_o just make a loop and find a place where there'll be no telefrag xD

[Vincent(PDP)]

32 teleports O_o just make a loop and find a place where there'll be no telefrag xD

But what happens when there's no place for you? And how would you design this?

It's not bad to use 32 teleports on a big map. That way it's 100% sure that you will not get telefragged. (Assuming that you raise the teleport destinations to about Z-height 64.)

[Stiff]

Yea but there is not always place for 32 spots, else I already used this script since I found it out when I was working on ZE14.