0000401: Coop spying clients using the chasecam don't see any icons above the player sprite

Notes
(0008993) Watermelon (developer) 2014-06-10 15:50	Does this still happen in 2.0?

(0009012) Frits (reporter) 2014-06-10 17:44	This still happens in 1.2 and 2.0

(0009021) Watermelon (developer) 2014-06-10 22:04	Thanks for checking, set to confirmed

(0023933) Kaminsky (developer) 2024-08-13 14:43	'https://foss.heptapod.net/zandronum/zandronum-stable/-/merge_requests/167 [^]' The icons of the player you're spying on should now be visible when you, the local player, are in chasecam mode. Note that ally/enemy icons no longer appear over the head of the player being spied on (e.g. you). It's not very important to show these icons over ourselves, and it's better if they only show up for other players according to our perspective.

(0023943) unknownna (updater) 2024-08-14 23:38	Ok, so the new default behavior from here on is that no ally icons are drawn above yourself and any allies you spy on. Does this feel like the most right way to you? I have to say, I kind of liked it drawn all the time above your own player after testing the new behavior a bit. It feels a bit empty when it's suppressed from the chasecam now, especially for coop/survival and teammodes. There's a lesser sense of unit cohesion when it's not rendered all the time above yourself and other friendly players being spied on. See the attached screenshot. The icon is drawn above all your teammates except yourself. Having it drawn all the time combined with a feature like'https://zandronum.com/tracker/view.php?id=4292 [^]' would perhaps make it feel a bit less empty with ally icons enabled. I don't know, maybe it's just me. However, if the new behavior feels the best for you, I suppose it's ok too and we'll mark it as resolved. I just want a confirmation first.

(0023944) Kaminsky (developer) 2024-08-15 03:20	Are there examples of other video games that use their own ally/enemy icons and display them over your character (or whoever you're looking through) in addition to the other players in a similar manner? If there are any, then I might re-consider this. However, I'm not entirely convinced that displaying these icons over ourselves while in chasecam mode is logical because we're not an ally (or enemy) of "ourselves". These icons are better suited for displaying the relationship of other players to "us" than ourselves. The ally icon can also get in the way if you're trying to play in third person, notwithstanding the others icons that appear while the player's chatting or in the console/menu (in those cases, they're occupied with chatting or looking through the console/menu, so it's not much of an issue). Personally, I wouldn't mind it looking emptier when these icons only appear for the other players. Furthermore, I made the decision to redact these icons partly based on your suggestion in'https://zandronum.com/tracker/view.php?id=4296 [^]' before it closed: Quote from "unknownna" If ever changing this, either stop rendering the ally icon above your own player, or have the ally icon be rendered above your own player and other allies all the time. Emphasis on the "stop rendering the ally icon above your own player" part. I naturally assumed you'd be okay with this change too. Quote from "unknownna" Having it drawn all the time combined with a feature like'https://zandronum.com/tracker/view.php?id=4292 [^]' would perhaps make it feel a bit less empty with ally icons enabled. I don't know, maybe it's just me. For the same reason above, it doesn't seem logical to show ally/enemy icons from a true spectator's perspective (i.e. none of the in-game players are technically allies nor enemies to them, even if we wanted to assume), and while a CVar could be added to toggle this, I'm generally against adding options for every niche thing. That's particularly why I didn't address that ticket, unlike the other ones pertaining to the icons. Thanks for the testing and feedback, as always.

(0023946) unknownna (updater) 2024-08-15 17:23	Ok, then let's mark this as resolved and move on. Quote from Kaminsky For the same reason above, it doesn't seem logical to show ally/enemy icons from a true spectator's perspective (i.e. none of the in-game players are technically allies nor enemies to them, even if we wanted to assume), and while a CVar could be added to toggle this, I'm generally against adding options for every niche thing. That's particularly why I didn't address that ticket, unlike the other ones pertaining to the icons. Some older games like Star Wars: Jedi Academy seem to show team icons for true spectators, but the teams have separate red and blue icons. I don't remember if Quake 3 does something similar, as I don't have it installed at the moment. I still think it would be cool to see them as a spectator though, at least in coop modes where all players eventually become your allies when you join the game.

This issue is already marked as resolved. If you feel that is not the case, please reopen it and explain why.
Supporters:	ZzZombo
Opponents:	No one explicitly opposes this issue yet.

Issue History
Date Modified	Username	Field	Change
2011-04-24 08:16	unknownna	New Issue
2011-04-24 08:16	unknownna	File Added: Screenshot_Doom_20110424_101411.png
2012-06-09 13:22	Torr Samaho	Category	General => Bug
2014-06-10 15:50	Watermelon	Note Added: 0008993
2014-06-10 15:50	Watermelon	Status	new => feedback
2014-06-10 17:44	Frits	Note Added: 0009012
2014-06-10 22:04	Watermelon	Note Added: 0009021
2014-06-10 22:04	Watermelon	Status	feedback => confirmed
2024-08-08 13:03	Kaminsky	Relationship added	related to 0004378
2024-08-12 17:56	unknownna	Relationship added	has duplicate 0004296
2024-08-13 14:43	Kaminsky	Note Added: 0023933
2024-08-13 14:43	Kaminsky	Assigned To	=> Kaminsky
2024-08-13 14:43	Kaminsky	Status	confirmed => needs review
2024-08-13 14:43	Kaminsky	Target Version	=> 3.2
2024-08-14 23:38	unknownna	Note Added: 0023943
2024-08-14 23:38	unknownna	Status	needs review => feedback
2024-08-14 23:39	unknownna	File Added: Screenshot_Doom_20240815_013149.png
2024-08-15 03:20	Kaminsky	Note Added: 0023944
2024-08-15 17:23	unknownna	Note Added: 0023946
2024-08-15 17:23	unknownna	Status	feedback => assigned
2024-08-15 17:23	unknownna	Status	assigned => resolved
2024-08-15 17:23	unknownna	Fixed in Version	=> 3.2
2024-08-15 17:23	unknownna	Resolution	open => fixed