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0001850Zandronum[All Projects] Suggestionpublic2014-06-19 18:022017-10-30 00:20
JKist3 
Dusk 
normalminorhave not tried
acknowledgedopen 
 
 
0001850: Software renderer users must be allowed to change r_visibility when sv_forcegldefaults is 0
players using opengl can use gl_ambientlight to fully light maps if sv_forcegldefaults is not set on the server. To me it would make sense to allow players using software rendering to have the same or at least similar ability.
No tags attached.
related to 0002258closed Edward-san sv_forcegldefaults is broken 
parent of 0000588feedback  Add option to disable fog for software renderer 
has duplicate 0002259closed  Software renderer users must be allowed to change r_visibility when sv_forcegldefaults is 0 
Not all the children of this issue are yet resolved or closed.
Issue History
2014-06-19 18:02JKist3New Issue
2014-06-19 18:40CatastropheNote Added: 0009596
2014-06-19 21:38DuskNote Added: 0009598
2014-06-21 12:58LeonardNote Added: 0009610
2014-06-25 22:03JKist3Note Added: 0009746
2014-06-26 05:55Blzut3Note Added: 0009748
2014-06-26 07:41JKist3Note Added: 0009749
2014-06-28 05:51Blzut3Note Added: 0009769
2014-06-28 06:07JKist3Note Added: 0009770
2014-06-28 06:08JKist3Note Edited: 0009770bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=9770#r5217
2014-06-28 06:09JKist3Note Edited: 0009770bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=9770#r5218
2014-06-28 09:03FritsNote Added: 0009772
2014-06-28 09:07FritsNote Edited: 0009772bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=9772#r5220
2014-06-28 09:08FritsNote Edited: 0009772bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=9772#r5221
2015-06-06 19:13unknownnaAssigned To => Dusk
2015-06-06 19:13unknownnaStatusnew => acknowledged
2015-06-06 19:13unknownnaSummaryallow client enabled infrared goggled on servers with sv_forcegldefaults 0 => Software renderer users must be allowed to change r_visibility when sv_forcegldefaults is 0
2015-06-06 19:14unknownnaRelationship addedhas duplicate 0002259
2015-06-11 11:15DuskNote Added: 0012649
2015-06-11 11:16DuskNote Edited: 0012649bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=12649#r7377
2015-06-11 12:17DuskNote Edited: 0012649bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=12649#r7378
2015-06-11 22:16unknownnaRelationship addedparent of 0000588
2015-06-12 10:57DuskRelationship addedrelated to 0002258

Notes
(0009596)
Catastrophe   
2014-06-19 18:40   
Although you can make an addon to do this, I do agree it should be on in every server to give software users an equal playing field against opengl players.
(0009598)
Dusk   
2014-06-19 21:38   
There is a CVAR called r_visibility which is the software-equivalent of gl_ambientlight. It is however latched in netgames and cannot be changed.
(0009610)
Leonard   
2014-06-21 12:58   
I actually wanted to make a ticket about r_visibility to make it changeable in net games.
r_visibility 0 makes software look way better imo.
(0009746)
JKist3   
2014-06-25 22:03   
sounds like r_visibility should be usable in netgames unless sv_forcegldefaults is enabled (maybe good to rename sv_forcegldefaults in this case)
(0009748)
Blzut3   
2014-06-26 05:55   
Why do we allow OpenGL users to increase the light level again?
(0009749)
JKist3   
2014-06-26 07:41   
I dont know. But as far as i know in other games like quake, the standard is to allow it, which i personally think is ok. I would rather play a game where both players compete to the best of their abilities rather than being hampered by visibility issues. Still for those who don't share my philosophy, it's up to the server to allow this.
(0009769)
Blzut3   
2014-06-28 05:51   
Well historically speaking r_visibility was once a user setting. It got disabled since it was deemed cheating. I'm not sure I would consider the Quake series the best thing to compare to since as I understand people play with texture mapping off and everything. Personally I think it has gone too far if that's what the goal is.

Lighting was kind of a big deal for Doom, so it would be sad to see it dismissed. Traditionally the only option you had to increase the brightness was to wash out the colors (increase gamma). If you're going to argue visibility issues, perhaps we should just include a wall hack so you can always see where your opponent is right? :P
(0009770)
JKist3   
2014-06-28 06:07   
(edited on: 2014-06-28 06:09)
Quote from Blzut3
Well historically speaking r_visibility was once a user setting. It got disabled since it was deemed cheating. I'm not sure I would consider the Quake series the best thing to compare to since as I understand people play with texture mapping off and everything. Personally I think it has gone too far if that's what the goal is.


The quake series are the games closest to doom and they are taken seriously competitively so if any game is comparable it is quake. For what it's worth i think you should be able to play doom without texture mapping as well.

Quote from Blzut3
Lighting was kind of a big deal for Doom, so it would be sad to see it dismissed. Traditionally the only option you had to increase the brightness was to wash out the colors (increase gamma). If you're going to argue visibility issues, perhaps we should just include a wall hack so you can always see where your opponent is right? :P


A wallhack shows information that as a user you are not supposed to have. While this could also happen in certain situations with r_visibility (completely dark rooms where you are not supposed to be able to see anyone), 99% of the time it's about making information clearer that is already given to you. Clearly there is support from community members for this feature, but there are also some like yourself who arent huge fans. Seems like a server controlled variable is probably the way to go?

(0009772)
Frits   
2014-06-28 09:03   
(edited on: 2014-06-28 09:08)
I'm all in for giving software users r_visibility to level the playingground.
The opposite i detest. A server that forces gldefaults is an instant disconnect from me.
I don't really care that you put a lot of lightning effort in your map and i don't want to see it. This should be up to me not you/server how i want my game to look.
Edit: comparing this to wallhack is ridiculous, not going to eleborate on that.

(0012649)
Dusk   
2015-06-11 11:15   
(edited on: 2015-06-11 12:17)
I think this is something that is way too late to argue about. Users can change light level in the GL renderer and that's clearly not going to change. So we should allow software users to do the same.

However, now the name of sv_forcegldefaults is becoming misleading because it will have an effect on the software renderer as well. It has only ever got to do with lighting anyway (it never for instance restricted texture filtering) so I suggest we rename it to sv_defaultlighting.