YAY DRAMA - New rules

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#41

Post by Catastrophe » Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:50 pm

Tbh, Leonard doesn't deserve a ban. He fessed up, and the worst thing his client did was just drop SSG's, you guys are overreacting like crazy. Now if it were something as bad as the ping exploit Alien Overlord made.....
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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#42

Post by John Zombie » Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:59 pm

The only one overreacting like crazy here is him, the whole point of him doing hacks is he should at least keep a low profile instead of biting the hand that feeds him and shovel shit to the staff just because they don't ban people he dislikes, since what he did(and most likely still does) is way more ban-worthy than calling out retards on a forum.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#43

Post by Sean » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:16 pm

Yay, drama in a thread about rules about preventing drama.

Code: Select all

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#44

Post by Ivan » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:32 pm

Cool changes, if a handsome moderator will watch over me when I go into probation, then I'll take it. (No, not TTA pls)

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#45

Post by The Toxic Avenger » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:56 pm

Hey, any posts continuing Leonard vs everyone will be split from here on out and possibly warned depending on context.

Have an ice day!

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#46

Post by Mobius » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:13 pm

Wow after reading this over all it proves is that without drama there will be no place for us to actively convene in. I don't know about any of you but Altdeath is a simple reminder of uncontrolled trolling and how such a fiasco of a forum turned out such brilliant activity; likewise, if you start to overly regulate it then you get the ghost-town we had post-Metal's departure or even Zdaemon forums. I know the staff is sick to death of all the inconsequential nobodies who don't ever post complaining about Decay (yet being the heralds of drama themselves who initiate it) and that an easier way to manage disputes is to be preemptive and cut the shit, but honestly perhaps if banning certain people who should have been banned to begin with would have probably saved this discussion a whole lot of headache.

Just a little food for thought.
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YAY DRAMA - New rules

#47

Post by Ru5tK1ng » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:24 pm

I'm stunned because all you do is shut down the people who try to point out how you're doing a terrible job about decay so far but not decay's posts.
Because you do it in the most ineffective way. Have you ever sat in the staff channel and tried to lay out a case logically and diplomatically? The method you've employed most recently has led to, less than stellar, results shown in this topic.

Leonard wrote: This very post was shown as an example in JWarrier's thread and it is still not removed to this day.
Its a good example until you put it into context. Had that post been directed at a person who wasn't a hacker, rat, ban evader, clan invader (pretending to be someone new), and a flat out scumbag in terms of his actions, then yes, that post is candidate for removal. Considering FateLord and what he's done, there's little sympathy.

Yet JWarrier's thread was locked within a day.
Because Jwarrier proved he had no intentions of doing anything other than stirring up drama. Notice in that thread when people asked legitimate questions (i.e. me), he disappeared. Additionally Jwarrier was blatantly stated in public on IRC long before that topic that he would make sure to get rid of Decay (and friends including me). Essentially it was a personal vendetta and his topic was just created for that sole purpose even if he tried to hide his intent under the guise of doing the community a favor. He sought be a Zandronum Hero, but he ended up lower than zero.

And the forum is just full of these.
Excluding the Karakurt example, you are linking posts to threads regarding cheaters and people involved in exploitation. This is just the community handling cheaters and individuals who have been caught cheating have always been met with that type of attitude in the Doom community. Go back several years and you'll see this type of thing wasn't created by Decay and others. Also, Alien embraces his Autism title because he gives ZERO fucks about it.


As a side notice, it is worth noting that people used to get warned and suspended for back seat modding. In other communities you get flat out banned especially if you do it publicly multiple times.
Last edited by Ru5tK1ng on Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#48

Post by ibm5155 » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:27 pm

It's sad that almost all the community is only viewing the threads because of shit posting/drama, it's like an reality show, where you only watch the program because there's a group of people doing drama (don't giving a :igor: for the program content), and when these drama guys go out the show, the audience goes to zero.

So, it's more a matter of what you guys want, let these drama guys into the fórum for audience, or remove these guys, and focusing into a community that actually cares about zandronum content...
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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#49

Post by Leonard » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:49 pm

Ru5tK1ng wrote:Its a good example until you put it into context. Had that post been directed at a person who wasn't a hacker, rat, ban evader, clan invader (pretending to be someone new), and a flat out scumbag in terms of his actions, then yes, that post is candidate for removal. Considering FateLord and what he's done, there's little sympathy.

Excluding the Karakurt example, you are linking posts to threads regarding cheaters and people involved in exploitation. This is just the community handling cheaters and individuals who have been caught cheating have always been met with that type of attitude in the Doom community. Go back several years and you'll see this type of thing wasn't created by Decay and others. Also, Alien embraces his Autism title because he gives ZERO fucks about it.
Sure people may or may not have deserved what they got, but like I said that's pretty much out of the question.
If you have a rule saying people should respect each other, you have to apply it to everyone.
Even if it was said to a cheater or whatever, it doesn't change the fact that said post violates the rule and is inappropriate.

Those weren't the only example anyways, what about this thing carpathia pointed out?
Ru5tK1ng wrote:As a side notice, it is worth noting that people used to get warned and suspended for back seat modding. In other community you get flat out banned especially if you do it publicly multiple times.
Like I already said, I'm not trying to get specific people I dislike banned. I'm trying to make the staff react for once. It's criticism (at least I see it that way) which I thought the staff wanted to hear.
Just have a look at this whole thread and honestly tell me, don't you think some people deserve at the very least a warning?
Ru5tK1ng wrote:Because you do it in the most ineffective way. Have you ever sat in the staff channel and tried to lay out a case logically and diplomatically? The method you've employed most recently has led to, less than stellar, results shown in this topic.
Well I never intended for this to become another drama thread, I tried to keep my first post as civil as possible (except for john zombie, I can't do much if you're asking for it).
I thought since this concerns everyone the public might want to hear about this..

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#50

Post by Dynamo » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:53 pm

Leonard wrote:If you have a rule saying people should respect each other, you have to apply it to everyone.

don't you think some people deserve at the very least a warning?
I couldn't agree more, friend. Just a warning might be cutting it some slack, actually.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#51

Post by Decay » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:55 pm

Leonard wrote:(except for john zombie, I can't do much if you're asking for it).
Wow, people asking for it. Dynamo also asked for it in that pm apparently.
Take responsibility for your actions. You are no better than me, and arguably worse.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#52

Post by Mobius » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:59 pm

Leonard wrote: Sure people may or may not have deserved what they got, but like I said that's pretty much out of the question.
If you have a rule saying people should respect each other, you have to apply it to everyone.
The staff have better things to do than to moderate petty little grievances people have among each other. The only reason Mifu made this announcement is to now enshrine that they will take a proactive stance in quelling conflict despite who shot first. You are getting mad over something that is retroactively bunk over something that is currently being pushed. No one is obliged to respect anyone or entitled to it, and this is double if both people have a history with each other.

Leonard wrote:Even if it was said to a cheater or whatever, it doesn't change the fact that said post violates the rule and is inappropriate.
Social Hierarchy. Talk to Kal Foxis and Shadowfox how this worked for them.
Leonard wrote:Like I already said, I'm not trying to get specific people I dislike banned. I'm trying to make the staff react for once. It's criticism (at least I see it that way) which I thought the staff wanted to hear.
Just have a look at this whole thread and honestly tell me, don't you think some people deserve at the very least a warning?
That is not up to YOU to decide who gets or deserves a warning, if the staff is not handing them out then it warrants no penalty. This whole thread is indicative to how inept you are in approaching diplomacy and I only needed to see this by reading how flippant you were in the tracker.
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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#53

Post by John Zombie » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:06 pm

Leonard wrote:except for john zombie, I can't do much if you're asking for it)
You're acting like a raging queer with everyone trying to reason with you, but nice try at focusing on myself only :lol:
Also all I did was bringing a legitimate point: you've been handing hacks to your buttbuddies since a while now, the staff closed an eye on you, and to show your gratefulness you proceeded to call them incompetent because they didn't apply the rules to someone you dislike ???
Your whole crusade doesn't make any sense to anyone, it looks more like you're the umpteenth nobody trying to get his 5 minutes of fame with a retarded pretext.
Now please keep dodging the point I brought, perhaps instigate a few more people to kill themselves, you're doing pretty well at supporting your cause against "the evil people insulting on the forums and breaking the rules" so far

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#54

Post by Ru5tK1ng » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:07 pm

Leonard wrote:
Ru5tK1ng wrote:Its a good example until you put it into context. Had that post been directed at a person who wasn't a hacker, rat, ban evader, clan invader (pretending to be someone new), and a flat out scumbag in terms of his actions, then yes, that post is candidate for removal. Considering FateLord and what he's done, there's little sympathy.

Excluding the Karakurt example, you are linking posts to threads regarding cheaters and people involved in exploitation. This is just the community handling cheaters and individuals who have been caught cheating have always been met with that type of attitude in the Doom community. Go back several years and you'll see this type of thing wasn't created by Decay and others. Also, Alien embraces his Autism title because he gives ZERO fucks about it.
Sure people may or may not have deserved what they got, but like I said that's pretty much out of the question.
If you have a rule saying people should respect each other, you have to apply it to everyone.
Even if it was said to a cheater or whatever, it doesn't change the fact that said post violates the rule and is inappropriate.
I agree that the rules should be upheld equality across the community as much as possible. However, keep in mind in this specific case regarding cheaters, let us briefly state what it is that they did. They cheated which in turn violates the community rules. I don't see any reason why the rules should protect someone who has blatantly broken one of the more severe community rules.
Those weren't the only example anyways, what about this thing carpathia pointed out?
I didn't see it because it's in the trash, but regardless it isn't clear what his point is. Is he insinuating that people attacking 1 person is common place on the forums? I'm not going to say whether his assertion is correct or not, but I will comment on his post example. He states the community 'is full of aggressive retards' and then is surprised people lashed out at him. Making broad generalizations is never a good idea no matter what the subject is. Additionally, his post qualifies as passive aggressive and as well all know, aggression leads to return aggression.
Ru5tK1ng wrote:As a side notice, it is worth noting that people used to get warned and suspended for back seat modding. In other community you get flat out banned especially if you do it publicly multiple times.
Like I already said, I'm not trying to get specific people I dislike banned. I'm trying to make the staff react for once. It's criticism (at least I see it that way) which I thought the staff wanted to hear.
Just have a look at this whole thread and honestly tell me, don't you think some people deserve at the very least a warning?
It really is irrelevant to what I think in terms of punishment because I am not staff. Should there be some sort of corrective actions? Yes. I'll point to TTA's post as such. What kind of action should occur to people in this thread is purely subjective and varies from individual.
Ru5tK1ng wrote:Because you do it in the most ineffective way. Have you ever sat in the staff channel and tried to lay out a case logically and diplomatically? The method you've employed most recently has led to, less than stellar, results shown in this topic.
Well I never intended for this to become another drama thread, I tried to keep my first post as civil as possible (except for john zombie, I can't do much if you're asking for it).
I thought since this concerns everyone the public might want to hear about this..
Public call outs generally do not turn out well at all. There's always a high percentage of things going haywire and that's just how it is.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#55

Post by Leonard » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:13 pm

In case some people didn't notice, Dynamo was the one to pm me first whining about his victory over the post splits.
Wouldn't you have responded with "fuck off" too if you were in my place?
It does legitimately look like bias (which is frustrating) if you compare his post and mine and which one was trashed.
And yes, I did get a warning for that and I take it, I deserve it maybe but at least the staff are now reacting which was the point.
Decay, what about you? Can't you agree? Can you check the very first line of your very first post in this thread? Isn't it about calling someone a retard? Did you get a warning for this? Thought so.
Mobius wrote:That is not up to YOU to decide who gets or deserves a warning
I never implied I'm the one who decides.
Mobius wrote:if the staff is not handing them out then it warrants no penalty.
Why are the staff not handing them out in the first place? Can you justify such a thing other than with pure bias?
This is why I'm criticizing them right now.
John Zombie wrote:You're acting like a raging queer with everyone trying to reason with you, but nice try at focusing on myself only :lol:
Okay JZ, take a look at decay's post for example. Do you think he was trying to reason with me at all when he decided to call me a retard?
Once he posts that, why should I even bother giving him a proper reply, there's nothing to say, no material to work with.

EDIT:
Ru5tK1ng wrote:What kind of action should occur to people in this thread is purely subjective and varies from individual.
I can agree with that sure but every individual have to be taken in account, not just the ones who posted after TTA's warning.
Of course you might say that that's just my opinion but I'm pretty sure taking everyone in account here could potentially prevent the same things from happening again which is the whole point of warnings.
Last edited by Leonard on Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#56

Post by Dynamo » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:22 pm

You know, for being one who accuses others of pulling stuff out of their asses, you sure are the master of this art.
Leonard wrote:In case some people didn't notice, Dynamo was the one to pm me first whining about his victory over the post splits.
Everyone noticed because I posted both my PM and your answer. Unlike you, who said blatantly false stuff to a moderator when questioned about it, I have nothing to hide.
Leonard wrote:Wouldn't you have responded with "fuck off" too if you were at my place?
The fact you don't understand the difference between "fuck off" and what you have typed is honestly concerning, but then again, considering your coherence equals 0 it's not exactly surprising either.
Leonard wrote:It does legitimately look like bias (which is frustrating) if you compare his post and mine and which one was trashed.
Well, it looks like a bias to you and you only: you have done a splendid job earlier at completely ignoring the parts of my posts where I explained your trolling but instead nitpicked on the smaller points and made personal attacks against me and passive aggressive comments about my posts. Do you even read what you write?
Leonard wrote:And yes, I did get a warning for that and I take it, I deserve it maybe but at least the staff are now reacting which was the point.
The fact that you acknowledge you deserve this means you are perfectly aware of the severity of the comment you directed at me. I've been a member of this community for over 10 years now, and even during the time I was a staff member, I don't recall seeing anybody stooping as low as you just did here, today. You are completely unashamed of what you said and at least 100000000000 times worse than the so called troublemakers which you claim ruin the forums, when in reality, it is exactly people like YOU who ruin the experience for everyone. You have been going on for weeks on your personal vendetta against Decay, SwiftShot, JohnZombie and god knows who else, without anybody ever asking you to do so (myself and Ru5tK1ng have explained why it is a terrible idea to do it in public but you have completely ignored that, too). What you do is beyond backseat moderating, it is straight up spamming

Ask yourselves if a person who would tell someone to go kill themselves over what he deems to be a "victory over the post splits" (really?) is the type of person you want to have to allow a community to thrive and be comprised of respectful people. Ask yourselves if this type of behaviour is productive in any way or if it actually simply shows the hypocrisy, the incoherence, as well as the squalor of this individual.

Zandronum deserves better than this.
Last edited by Dynamo on Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#57

Post by Mobius » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:27 pm

Leonard wrote:I never implied I'm the one who decides.
This is what your line of reasoning is

"Just have a look at this whole thread and honestly tell me, don't you think some people deserve at the very least a warning?"

You were appealing to Rust's rational over what is or isn't acceptable forum etiquette coming from a guy who made a whole thread about banning another member and insulting the staff while you backseat mod. That's clearly you taking agency of others to enforce a will of your own. So again by whose definition of "deserve" are we speaking of when regarding this thread? Since you're the one propositioning the staff to do "anything" than obviously it is YOU who you were speaking from. I don't think anyone deserves a ban if you ask me so obviously it isn't a universal consensus as this thread has eloquently pointed out.
Leonard wrote: Why are the staff not handing them out in the first place? Can you justify such a thing other than with pure bias?
This is why I'm criticizing them right now.
Because it is their judgement to make. You are literally arguing with people who have critiqued forum polices way before you and at a much larger scale than you have ever indicated. Your line of thought is if the staff decide to idle than it is bias. So obviously unless they do what you say or desire than it is negative and evil. The bias is coming from two directions. I won't deny that Decay can learn a bit more tact.. a lot more tact, but as someone who knows what's happening you are literally crying about a guy who can sneeze wrong and be permanently dealt with but somehow the staff is doing nothing about Decay yeah okay there buddy.
Last edited by Mobius on Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#58

Post by Leonard » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:37 pm

Dynamo wrote:You know, for being one who accuses others of pulling stuff out of their asses, you sure are the master of this art.
And what a valuable input you give us again.
Dynamo wrote:Unlike you, who said blatantly false stuff to a moderator when questioned about it, I have nothing to hide.
Please point to the proof? Aren't you pulling that out of your ass too maybe?
Dynamo wrote:The fact you don't understand the difference between "fuck off" and what you have typed is honestly concerning
Dynamo wrote:and at least 100000000000 times worse than the so called troublemakers which you claim ruin the forums
That's purely subjective.
But alright, if you think it's that bad then sorry, what I truly wanted to express was just a simple "fuck off".
Dynamo wrote:You have been going on for weeks on your personal vendetta against Decay, SwiftShot, JohnZombie and god knows who else
I had only talked with Decay once before this and as for the other ones I never ever mentioned them before this.
I'm going to assume you pulled this out of your ass aswell unless you have proof?
Dynamo wrote:you have done a splendid job earlier at completely ignoring the parts of my posts where I explained your trolling but instead nitpicked on the smaller points and made personal attacks against me and passive aggressive comments about my posts.
Where did you explain how I was trolling?
Are you talking about that time you said that it was my post that deserves to be trashed?
Because honestly I can't see.
Dynamo wrote:Ask yourselves if this type of behaviour is productive in any way or if it actually simply shows the hypocrisy, the incoherence, as well as the squalor of this individual.
Because you replying with "go ahead, leave" was such a productive behavior.
PMing me to whine about the fact that my post got trashed but not yours sure is a productive behavior.

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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#59

Post by Catastrophe » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:41 pm

Need proof on his "vendetta" against JohnZombie and Swiftshot outside of this thread please.
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Re: YAY DRAMA - New rules

#60

Post by John Zombie » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:42 pm

Leonard wrote:Okay JZ, take a look at decay's post for example. Do you think he was trying to reason with me at all when he decided to call me a retard?
Once he posts that, why should I even bother giving him a proper reply, there's nothing to say, no material to work with.
A better question would be: Why on earth you decided to pop out of the blue and stir up this mess against the staff/Decay?
As far as I know it all started because you claimed Decay deserves to be banned for his posts while the staff does nothing about it, what Decay did afterwards is called retaliation(but probably that was exactly what you were aiming for :rolleyes:)
Point is, I don't recall Decay calling you names or doing anything against you before you pulled out this farce

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