Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

Maps, modifications, add-ons, projects, and other releases for Zandronum. Also includes announcers.
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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#221

Post by ARGENTVM » Mon Apr 11, 2016 2:04 am

I talked to AlexMax some time ago about Skirmish MAP01; if I recall correctly it is being replaced by Skirmish MAP18.

Brit10 MAP07 - Fun map despite being a square; probably better candidates for removal.
Chill3 MAP07 - Have to agree with the above; the map isn't fun. Then again, I'm not a fan of Chill3.
Geography Duel - Not a really fun map; as mentioned before the spawns are way too close together and map gives the vibe of an undetailed Skulltag Stock DM map for some reason (maybe it's just the music doing it for me).
Sipooma - Don't really have much of an opinion on this map, but I don't see this one getting removed after the last time it was removed.
Skirmish MAP01 - Just talked about it. Too bad no one said anything during testing!
UDM3 MAP03 - Map seems too big for duels since it was made for Deathmatch. Can't see it being played often.

Not sure what other Dweller candidates would be out there (especially without chainsaw spawns or spawns facing walls/impassible ledges).

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#222

Post by ZZYZX » Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:23 am

geography_duel is absolute utter trash
chill3 is just outright boring
udm3 map03 is a nice run'n'gun map 10/10 should stay unless Alex adds Oblivx4
sipooma is being picked
brit10 map07 is awesome compared to everything listed above
also why noone mentioned uptightdm upt08?

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#223

Post by Combinebobnt » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:47 am

Hey alex when is update, duel got revived by some1.

new suggestion list:
kid duel/udm3/gw16 is boring nobody picks replace please
geography/chill3 still SUCKS. tittymilk was way better than chill3

glass219/sipooma can stay because dranzer and ralphis wdl and good roskings
arg has like 69 replacements ready for skirmish01 just talk to him (skirmish 18)
the uptightdms are kind of boring shoot reduxes with nothing interesting, 31 is marginally funner than 08. i say replace 08 nobody picks it anyway
dont TOUCH my brit10map07 i pick it more times than anybody joins the server thanks

oh yea xenos9 has some nasty ass exit teleporter strategy. fix? its really friggin powerful. good map besides that

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#224

Post by Shane » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:35 pm

wowee I'd prefer it if people drew their opinion on uptdm08 until after alexmax puts in the final version of it I released to him last year. Regardless it's still inferior to 31, but no one even picks maps outside of ssl2, d5m1, d2m1, d5m7, judas and king1 as learning duel maps is a really tough profession. Unless you get the oddball that picks dweller then it's most likely a player that absolutely nobody likes.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#225

Post by Ru5tK1ng » Mon Sep 05, 2016 6:03 pm

but no one even picks maps outside of ssl2, d5m1, d2m1, d5m7, judas and king1 as learning duel maps is a really tough profession.
Maybe capo was right that all duel maps suck. Only 5 good maps out of several dozens. :/

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#226

Post by ARGENTVM » Mon Sep 05, 2016 6:28 pm

Combinebobnt wrote:Hey alex when is update, duel got revived by some1.
arg has like 69 replacements ready for skirmish01 just talk to him (skirmish 18)
Yep, we talked about that some time ago and Skirmish MAP18 (the HR2 tribute map - Reignited/Reignition/can't remember ahhhhh help me) was what was decided.

In addition....

Super secret are you ready?

[spoiler]In addition to that, I've actually been working on a second set of maps. Still need to test the layouts and detail, but it shouldn't take long if everything goes well. They are not a standard set of maps that revolve simply on run-and-gun SSG "fun", but that's a secret between you and I and everyone else who reads this thread.[/spoiler]

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#227

Post by ZZYZX » Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:45 am

Shane wrote:wowee I'd prefer it if people drew their opinion on uptdm08 until after alexmax puts in the final version of it I released to him last year. Regardless it's still inferior to 31, but no one even picks maps outside of ssl2, d5m1, d2m1, d5m7, judas and king1 as learning duel maps is a really tough profession. Unless you get the oddball that picks dweller then it's most likely a player that absolutely nobody likes.
When was the last time you played duels again? There are at least 5 people who'd play dweller a lot, and also moo2d and exposed.
Also, gw16 is useful in rare cases when you need shoot with walls.
geography, kid_duel and skirmish maps suck dick though.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#228

Post by Ru5tK1ng » Tue Sep 06, 2016 2:52 pm

Allen wrote:Also, gw16 is useful in rare cases when you need shoot with walls.
There already is a shoot with walls in duel40. It's called greenwar 20.

I'm still convinced geography duel is an elaborate troll by Alex.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#229

Post by Combinebobnt » Tue Sep 06, 2016 3:43 pm

I think gw20/moo2d/d5m7/even grass219 blow gw16 away anyday. They all have shoot with walls going on as well as stairs/bfg/weapon control/ralphis going on in addition. Gw16 has its windows 95 maze shape that doesn't really appear in any other maps (d2m1? lol?), how useful can it really be?

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#230

Post by Catastrophe » Tue Sep 06, 2016 4:13 pm

+1 for removal of GW16. Awful map, shouldn't have been brought back.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#231

Post by ARGENTVM » Tue Sep 06, 2016 5:16 pm

Ali-In Overtlard wrote:
Shane wrote:wowee I'd prefer it if people drew their opinion on uptdm08 until after alexmax puts in the final version of it I released to him last year. Regardless it's still inferior to 31, but no one even picks maps outside of ssl2, d5m1, d2m1, d5m7, judas and king1 as learning duel maps is a really tough profession. Unless you get the oddball that picks dweller then it's most likely a player that absolutely nobody likes.
When was the last time you played duels again? There are at least 5 people who'd play dweller a lot, and also moo2d and exposed.
Also, gw16 is useful in rare cases when you need shoot with walls.
geography, kid_duel and skirmish maps suck dick though.
Can't appease everyone I guess :cool: oh well!
Ru5tK1ng wrote:I'm still convinced geography duel is an elaborate troll by Alex.
It wouldn't be the first time (Brit9M1, anything from Chill), plus the CCarnage troll from an earlier map selection.
Combinebobnt wrote:I think gw20/moo2d/d5m7/even grass219 blow gw16 away anyday. They all have shoot with walls going on as well as stairs/bfg/weapon control/ralphis going on in addition. Gw16 has its windows 95 maze shape that doesn't really appear in any other maps (d2m1? lol?), how useful can it really be?
Doesn't help with the flat, boring nature of the map with awkward structure consisting of secret "doors", dead ends, and a blue armor next to a BFG.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#232

Post by ZZYZX » Tue Sep 06, 2016 8:53 pm

Combinebobnt wrote:Gw16 has its windows 95 maze shape that doesn't really appear in any other maps (d2m1? lol?), how useful can it really be?
Useful? what
It's not useful, it's just fun to play, especially with high ping. Because then you can listen to the sounds and then shoot through corners and sometimes walls.
idk, I personally like that map because it can be played with 0% brain usage and still winning sometimes. Not like gw20 or moo2d, in gw16 you can run in circles and shoot. Good map to relax after boring king1, judas23 and d5m1 games.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#233

Post by Ivan » Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:36 pm

ZZYZX wrote:
Combinebobnt wrote:Gw16 has its windows 95 maze shape that doesn't really appear in any other maps (d2m1? lol?), how useful can it really be?
Useful? what
It's not useful, it's just fun to play, especially with high ping. Because then you can listen to the sounds and then shoot through corners and sometimes walls.
idk, I personally like that map because it can be played with 0% brain usage and still winning sometimes. Not like gw20 or moo2d, in gw16 you can run in circles and shoot. Good map to relax after boring king1, judas23 and d5m1 games.
I question your idea of dueling.
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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#234

Post by AlexMax » Thu Sep 15, 2016 1:13 am

Congratulations, you guys are successfully nudging me towards a new release. I've already removed the following maps.
  • CHILL3 MAP07
  • GEOGRAPHY_DUEL
  • KID_DUEL MAP01
  • SKIRMISH MAP01
Uptight Deathmatch MAP08 is also getting an update to the latest version.

Unlike earlier releases, though, I simply don't have a ton of new maps to shove down your guys collective throats. Tentatively, this is what I have settled on:
But how long have I been doing Duel16/32/40? There have been a LOT of maps added and removed over the lifetime of the project. I think it might be a wise idea to take a look back and see if there are removed maps that might be...missed. Maybe there is something in here you guys would like to see again?

Or maybe not, but hey, we can maybe laugh together at all of the stupid decisions I have made over the years. I have provided wad-archive links whenever possible so you can see a screenshot of a map instead of having to download it. Fair warning, I might skip something by accident - getting these lists together is tedious work.

DUEL16 started with 16 maps. Of those original 16, the following maps are no longer in the compilation.
The earlist version of DUEL32 that I can find is Beta 3. Grandvoid actually still runs this compilation.
  • BRIT11 MAP02
  • DUEL16 - Secret map. The DUEL16 start map turned into a SSG arena.
  • DWANGO6 MAP11
  • HIPAFRAG
  • LEGEND-A - I can't find this WAD anywhere. I guess just load duel32-beta3 to see it, but you'll probably need skulltag textures so the start map doesn't break.
Beta 4 doesn't have anything that hasn't already been mentioned. Beta 5 contained the following maps:
  • FOXTROT - The original map, without the underscore
  • MANCERX MAP01 - This is actually an interesting case, as instead of using the original map, I used a modified version that was used in a ZDaemon tournament. I post both links for completeness sake, so you can decide for yourself if you like the updated version better or not.
  • METALDM
  • DWANGO6 MAP11 - This one also had a modified version
  • DOOM2 MAP01 - This one had a modified version as well, but I dare not post it.
Beta 6 contained the following maps:
Release Candidate 1 has nothing unique. Release Candidate 2 contained the following map:
After that release, I started using letters and started keeping stats. Release A contained the following unique maps:
We're now catching up with the beginning of the thread. Release C contained the following unique maps:
  • BRITISH9 MAP01 - Secret map. I also can't find this WAD anymore either, so just load up the old version of duel32 and find the secret map.
  • FAE_DUEL13 MAP01 - I don't think this ever got a widespread release. Again, just load up the old version.
  • GOTHICDM MAP02
  • TITMILK
Release D contained the following unique maps:
And finally, release F contained the following unique maps:
And just for kicks, there are maps that I had repeatedly toyed with adding over the years, but never added for one reason or another. D5M2 was on this list, but it's on the tenative add list:
  • DANZIG2 MAP19 - I'm not sure how I feel about the teleporter gimmicks or the fact that parts of the map are kind of obscure.
  • GOTHICDM MAP01 - There's only one SSG in the map, which people have bitched about in the past.
  • GOTHICDM MAP11 - Kind of big, has an annoying chaingun spawn.
  • MOO1M - Only 4 deathmatch spawns, a little rough around the edges, has a really stupid lighting gimmick that's an eyesore.
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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#235

Post by Combinebobnt » Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:33 am

nice update time

nice I've played all of those maps in a real game

nice

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#236

Post by Doomkid » Thu Sep 15, 2016 4:08 am

I'm (obviously) sad to see kid_duel map01 go but in all honesty that map is inferior to kid_duel map04 - I'd like to put that one up for consideration, the design was meant to work in OS or NS whereas kid_duel map01 sorta depends on item respawn to work as intended. Map01 is large enough to comfortably fit 4 players, but that's not really the case in map04 - The gameplay is much faster and the overall ground area is smaller. Take a peek and let me know what you think (it's even Decay-approved!)

I'd also like to see d5m2, bahdko1, d6m1 and danzig2 map19 in there. I've played these maps loads of times and they're just flat out fun. Some people here are good at quantifying why maps are good or bad but I'll just say I've never found myself bored on any of them and that they reward you if you stay focused.

I'm not huge on Brit10 Map01, a bit of a spamfest, I'd almost go so far as to say it's as boring as shoot. Greenwar map16 is fun, but I can agree that it's not really suitable for "serious" play with the secret doors and questionable placement. Edit: I also don't think GothicDM map01 or map11 would be that great, I've dueled on them both a few times and it was just frustrating on 01 (seriously fuck that little pit by the stairs) and plain boring on 11. Even if you win it feels like you just completed a slog more than a satisfying duel.

The Kid_duel 2 beta is well underway, I'll finally get around to adding the finishing touches to some of the maps. I think 01 from this newer project in particular could make a good candidate to replace my current map if kid_duel 04 isn't deemed good enough, will post a link soon.

EDIT: Decay has chimed in on the DW thread
Decay wrote: Seeing as I'm banned on zan forums, i'd like to point out that a lot of those maps that were removed from previous versions were removed with very good reason. These maps are bad, sucked to duel on, and were hardly played, and nobody that I've seen really cared that they were gone.

As for the new maps going in... I can't say I'm really a fan of Moo1m, but I'd personally like to see gothic map01 go in. I really enjoyed oblivx2, though there was one really bad catchy wall Bloodlust simply refused to change which is kinda dumb, but otherwise it serves as a great rough and tumble SSG blast fest, which would stand in great contrast to the gothic map.
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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#237

Post by Combinebobnt » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:39 am

thanks for removing 3 out of the 4 bad apples alex (still udm3 left with its 50% friggin deliberate completion rate JESUS). whatever is replacing them is pretty much guaranteed to be better. this was the biggest reason for my posting anyway

other:
d5m2 aka danzig$420$ - doomkid we finally got it YEA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! odamex?

danzig2 map19 - doomkid lets push for it? time for oldskool shotgun !!!!!!!!!!1 who needs an ssg anyway

uptight 8 updated - i guess time to pick it? hope it still isnt a ssg circle. i like picking 31 cuz the opponent gets pissed real fast l o l

brit 10 map01 looks like it probably will be a shitty bfg spam fest like it is in dm, good luck spawning. Probably best to keep it in dm. Don't forget though, this map replaces a bad apple and literally anything is better than the geocrapy chill3 snorefare it replaces. You could probably put almost anything (poor aurora) from your old list and it would still be better than the replaced map. What exactly I dunno cuz I'll play almost anything, probably want an opinion here from someone who hates things more.

kid duel 04 - yea looks better than 01; didnt this map have like a partial invisibility or is that doomkid dm i dunno?? nice switches activating things across the map that nobody is going to figure out what they do. replace gw16?

doomkid you may not be able to quantify maps but I can help u. the biggest reason stuff like d6m1 and badhoe are hated is because THEY ARE GIANT GOLF COURSES with a gun or 2. that is boring as hell and no skulltag dueler with an attention span of- hey look a small map with ssgs lets play that instead. (fuck d6m1 golf course though. at least bahdko tried). also dont even try some d5m1 bs, there is a reason judas23 is the top map. gg

moo1m - the map was ok i guess (good rockets?). about as engaging as a divorce. i dont think anybody besides me would like it.

goth01 - great map in 2v2 tdm would pick anyday (i do). duel however i'm not buying that anybody would play it. it would be like the only map to join the lonley pobla8 with a single ssg, and we can all see how control-ly pobla8 gets when someone gets that ssg and the other gets a bad spawn. gonna talk out of my ass because my last duel on this map was before they invented the ssg in 1869; would probably suffer from too much control on the SOLE ssg and bfg. they are both in the same spot and the map is flat unlike pobla8, so even worse. a good aim player could probably just do some eyedea super ssg rape in here and get a lead only defeatable by a lucky bfg spawn. map relies too much on rl/plasma to be fun enough for everybody tbh. fuck plasma anyway

goth11 - looks like an unfinished undetailed version of toke vexzdaemon. looks like it will play just like goth02 without the whole jumping off the map thing :-(

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#238

Post by stradex » Thu Sep 15, 2016 6:45 am

Bring back udmx map 02 , I don't care if people thinks that is a map for DM, its very entertaining for duel.

And don't dare to touch my loved gw20.

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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#239

Post by Doomkid » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:32 am

Thank you Boby, your whole post was really helpful and I agree with basically all of it. If D6M1 stays out I will understand, maybe I only like it because I got used to dueling on really huge boring maps when I was a kid, that one included. They don't bore me personally but I know the "hunt" aspect of a lot of old ass maps puts 99% of players to sleep.

Also yes dancing2 map19 is greatness!!!

EDIT: Oh yeah, kid_duel had an invis on map04 during the beta but I removed it because I finally realized that powerup is completely retarded in duel
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Re: Duel40a (May 27, 2015)

#240

Post by Marcaek » Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:17 am

bring back cannonball gw2 on top

(I don't want to make just a shitpost so thanks for maintaining this for so long Alex.)

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