Reviving STDL? * Update*

[Nati46]

Hey,
I've been wondering - since there has been no duel league in Zandronum for the past year or so, I was hoping that the former management or somebody else would pick it up.
I, given the semi-free schedule I will be having at around september, am willing to contribute and/or help manage such a league if anybody decides to set it up. Otherwise, I will probably try and manage my own.

A few questions pop up as a result :

- What should the map poll be? OS only? or NS + OS (similiar to the most recent league?) Should every map of duel32 be included in the poll, minus several ones which would be decided upon as not suitable?
Also, should there be a requirement to play atleast 1 NS map, like in the former league? Or should we let the players make their choice?

- If NS is chosen, should we choose typical duel32 (or other old maps) which are playable in NS settings (GW20 comes to mind, along with a few others), Or should we choose more recent mappacks (Such as MSDuel)? Maybe both?

- How many people are actually willing to sign up and play? The amount of people willing to play pretty much dictates the way the tiers will be divided, and whether this league will even take place to begin with.
Also, under what circumstances will some people not want to join (i.e what do you expect the league to have in order for you to join it.)
Such feedback is welcome and constructive.

- I think that a fraglimit of 50 is suitable for a tournament - In my opinion a 25 frag typical duel is too rushy and lacks the need to adapt to the other player's strategy, plus it is far more based on chance. Although, some specific maps might require suitable fraglimits - this will probably be implemented in the STDL-unique wad.

- What form of tier division should be made? Should it be Similiar to the ZDDL? Should there be only two divisions ? Again, this is heavily affected by the number of players from different tiers who would be willing to join.

- DMFlags : weaponswitch/wallrunning/crosshair etc - How OS should the OS mode actually be?
Regarding this, I think that weapon switch should be forced - In some maps this makes weapons like the BFG too easy to snatch while still taking down your opponet, which can make some maps pretty dull. Again, this is up to feedback!
Two-sided wallrunning is something I would find innovative, and crosshairs would probably win the majority's vote here (So the flags will pretty much be ZDaemon NS standard minus Weapon priority on a few maps.)
Note that DMflags may vary according to the map.
Also, how NS should the NS be ? No wallrunning? No infinite height rockets? any detailed post about the layout is welcome.

For any extra discussion, advice, or anything else regarding this, post your thoughts here or contact me on IRC.
Hoping to see a league coming up soon!

[Nati46]

Some quick input. Check this out first. It may answer some of your questions and help you out.

Definitely stick to a specific format; don't mix NS and OS, it's a recipe for disaster; however I only say this because I look at the past STDL's that implemented the mix and the bullshit that ensued. If you're guna do OS, do as close to real as OS as possible, don't half ass it. People really need to stop crying about weapon switching, it's really not a big deal, learn to fucking move.

If you wanna do NS, I think there are some pretty reasonable set ups for Zandronum available, talk to Legion about that. If in doubt, try Nero's set ups from ZDaemon.

The maplist should be pretty broad IMO, even if you know people will stick to a certain couple. This allows for a variety of gameplay, and players won't feel strangled by lack of choice. Nobody likes it when maps are shoved down their throats, ie if it's best 2/3 and there's only 3 maps, that's kinda shitty.

Good luck.

I am thinking of having about 5 or maybe even more maps - the problem is that I do not know which maps appeal to the majority, therefore I might, as you suggest, simply increase the map poll to contain many popular maps being played.
About only sticking to one style : If that will happen I will probably choose OS, but I do not see why we can't mix it - I don't recall it being that troublesome during the last STDL.
Any more feedback is appreciated

[legion]

I had planned to revive with a new duel league when the first stable version of zandronum came out

[map poll]
duel32 without a doubt, but for my ideas, I may run a league based off an old version of duel32 (for a: parity and b: set of different, stronger maps)

[type of tournament]
hopefully I can get the signups for a good ns league in the future, but for now I plan for a simple OS dueling tourney

[fraglimit]
usually people like 25 more but I think 40 will probably be best. not too long and not too short

[dmflags]
I find myself not caring at all and neither should you. caring about dmflag x and dmflag y should be left to people named jkist who actually worries about the tiniest doom bugs giving him an advantage against everyone else (this is true)

[setup]
my ideal type of tournament is kind of like zddl with 4 divisions but the problem with that is the ranking is so bloody arbitrary (in zddl) that you just cannot be sure of who goes into what division.

[Nati46]

I had planned to revive with a new duel league when the first stable version of zandronum came out

[map poll]
duel32 without a doubt, but for my ideas, I may run a league based off an old version of duel32 (for a: parity and b: set of different, stronger maps)

Shouldn't a STDL specific wad be made like last season? As in to present the current map poll without confusion. Or,if we want them to choose a variety of maps, we could just make an addon wad with flipcoin and any other features we would need.

[type of tournament]
hopefully I can get the signups for a good ns league in the future, but for now I plan for a simple OS dueling tourney

I have this feeling that a few potential players would not be interested if the duel does not have any NS in it. Again, it is up to them to give feedback.


[fraglimit]
usually people like 25 more but I think 40 will probably be best. not too long and not too short

That sounds good. Back when supergod's servers were around this was the fraglimit and I do remember the strategic matches where you could win from a -8 spread should you have been more cunning .


[dmflags]
I find myself not caring at all and neither should you. caring about dmflag x and dmflag y should be left to people named jkist who actually worries about the tiniest doom bugs giving him an advantage against everyone else (this is true)

Would like to hear what others have to say for this. Also, flags such as forced weapon switch are definitely not 'minor', and can have a big effect on how the map plays.

[setup]
my ideal type of tournament is kind of like zddl with 4 divisions but the problem with that is the ranking is so bloody arbitrary (in zddl) that you just cannot be sure of who goes into what division.


We could let each player to have part of the say over which division he is assigned to. Of course we will also make sure that a player's desired division does not exept too far from his experience.

If you are really going through with this, I volunteer to help.

[Springy]

I remember though last year that STDL was just dying out. Interest just seemed to have stopped. I did volunteer to help but I think it was a bit late but offer my services again if you need it.

[IdeIdoom]

[map poll]
duel32 without a doubt, but for my ideas, I may run a league based off an old version of duel32 (for a: parity and b: set of different, stronger maps)

The old Version would be suitable for this tournamet because the old maps are quite good , IMO. I would join, but if one of the maps is judas23, I may not play.

[Nati46]

[map poll]
duel32 without a doubt, but for my ideas, I may run a league based off an old version of duel32 (for a: parity and b: set of different, stronger maps)

The old Version would be suitable for this tournamet because the old maps are quite good , IMO. I would join, but if one of the maps is judas23, I may not play.

Which maps found the old duel32 would you like to see in the tournament?

Also, I'm sorry, but judas will most likely be in the map poll, being a very popular map - this is unless a majority who are commited to joining would want it out.

[IdeIdoom]

[map poll]
duel32 without a doubt, but for my ideas, I may run a league based off an old version of duel32 (for a: parity and b: set of different, stronger maps)

The old Version would be suitable for this tournamet because the old maps are quite good , IMO. I would join, but if one of the maps is judas23, I may not play.

Which maps found the old duel32 would you like to see in the tournament?
Edit : I would recommend posting Screenshots of demos after finishing the duel (all 2/3).

Also, I'm sorry, but judas will most likely be in the map poll, being a very popular map - this is unless a majority who are commited to joining would want it out.

I'll give it a try. And about old maps : GW16 or Legend-A
Edit : I would recommend posting screenshots or demos of all 2/3 duels here.

[Tenchu]

I only say this because I look at the past STDL's that implemented the mix and the bullshit that ensued.

I'll admit I probably could've picked a better replacement to run the STDL, but as you can probably imagine I didn't have too much incentive to really care for obvious reasons. So I do apologize for that.

Edit: For clarification, Legion now would probably do a pretty decent job. But the Legion back then was still pretty inexperienced and lazy, which is why the STDL did so bad after I left.

[Nati46]

New channel for discussion on the upcoming league, #STDuel, has been opened.
Feel free to join and give advice and/or help.

[Stan]

I posted here cuz Nati said to ;p

[Omega]

i personally would join , but IMO judas 23 is such a terrible map but it wouldnt stop me from actually playing in STDL , and if any help was needed i would be happy to, my schedule picks up around September though but it wouldnt stop me :D

[Dragon]

And now things are looking better in my eyes;
Good fraglimit
Good maps
More than just a simple elimination (more ZDDL / EDL style) giving every player more than just one shot.

I think we got something going here. Even though we're still doomed to not have successful leagues executed here.

But that's for us to change!

[Cennou]

Woah Nati likes too much Duel.
But seriously Judas23, I would play but Judas23 is just a meh But i hate pretty much every duel map so This is out of the question

[Ivan]

You better include Exposed, King1, D5M1, Uroburos and Judas !

[Dragon]

Then Ivan's up for a big disappointment!