Konar6a is editting my mod to advertise grandvoid, discuss

[Empyre]

How about you take the advertisement out of your mod and make a separate wad for your server that has only the ad? Then your mod could be hosted anywhere with no need for editing out your ad.

My $0.02.

[Zakken]

I agree it's his servers his rules, but directly editing code from my project without even asking WHILE knowing I don't like him is a dick move.

True enough. But that's Konar for you, I guess.

Your WAD is biased towards funcrusher by use of a hardcoded log message, which IMO is more serious than a simple ACS file copy with a minor edit like this, if we really are going to start splitting hairs about something this trivial.

It's his wad, he can be biased towards whatever he wants. But making add-on wads that change stuff from your own creation without you being even asked about it IS shady, to say the least. Who knows what else he's changed in the wads (and more importantly, his modified server client) without us knowing? Questions like this will obviously pop up now.

[Mobius]

So Catastrophe couldn't epic meme like he did with Superdemon cause Konar is sensible to advertise for his server instead of a "competing" server? Yet, somehow Konar is at fault here when you have lines from the wad author like

it's mainly because this guy is one of the worst server admins in the history of Zandro and needs to stop doing this shit

and this

Sure. Hopefully drama actually gets him to do his job.

and this

I don't see the problem in hard-coding a log message that tells people to go to a reliable auth server. It is my mod after all - which I eventually plan on hosting myself.

Then just host it yourself if you feel Konar is a poor choice of administration. Why didn't you get it ran on Best Ever then? Why are you disparaging the very host -- this is why this thread is poo poo.

In short: epic meme

[Catastrophe]

I don't see the problem in hard-coding a log message that tells people to go to a reliable auth server. It is my mod after all - which I eventually plan on hosting myself.

Then just host it yourself if you feel Konar is a poor choice of administration. Why didn't you get it ran on Best Ever then? Why are you disparaging the very host -- this is why this thread is poo poo.

It is hosted on best-ever. The whole point of this thread is because he copied an entire acs file from my project and editted it without permission. That is why he's at fault. Go actually read the thread.

Edit: As for the SuperDemon thing, at the time Konar was the only host. Best-Ever was released during the later versions of SuperDemon and I saw that there was really no point in switching over as it had been established there. If Best-Ever was available when I started working on SuperDemon, I would have certainly used it.

[Konar6]

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Thank you for making a dramatic thread instead of contacting me, it's been more than a week without drama and it was getting boring over here.

First of all, to correct the accusation, the patch wad is not supposed to "advertise" anything, there are no flying GV banners last time I checked.

While updating the SLMS server to the last version, I noticed it displays a screen message telling players to login on the NJ auth server. Since there is no official Zandronum auth server and GV has been using a different established auth server (it's reliable too, I tell you, it's hosted on a dedicated server box), the message would be misleading, which is unacceptable, as every reader would agree. I made a patch wad which changes "auth.funcrusher.net" to "grandvoid.sickedwick.net/auth" and explained that in the included readme. I don't know how to patch a simple line like that without copying the whole script - I'm no wad making expert. If someone can tell me a better solution to this, I'll happily use it.

Perhaps Empyre provided the best answer, tacking the mistake to the wad author, who hardcoded a specific server name, which, along with his remarks here could indicate a desire to control where his wad is hosted. I believe that's not the way to go and I'm sure even the developers would agree.

Though I can tell the main purpose of this thread was to spread rumors and push opinions of the creator. For one, demy veronika having rcon access was probably confused with BE, where she (and other 5 year old kids) indeed had rcon or even hosted the server. If anyone has any other outstanding concerns about GV, don't hesitate to contact me directly. Especially if you're going to pass on some rumors.

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<Catastrophe> but yeah maybe its time i just hide the source

So in the end, it looks like hardcoded server info will stubbornly remain in the wad, which means this outburst thread has lived up to the wad name in question. Idiotic.

[Catastrophe]

Or perhaps you can uh... Not edit my work in the first place. Feel free to host it yourself, but don't touch my stuff.

[Shane]

Your reign of tyranny is upon you Konar, denounce your faith and relinquish thy server access or suffer a fate that would take even the devil himself aback!!!!!!!!!!!

[mifu]

I must say this thread is well, what mobius said.. This thread is poo poo.

There are a few reasons. Though it seems that I do know where cata is coming from, the fact is.. its just a damn server message he edited. Yea ok maybe it would of been nice and all for konar to actually ask but remember he runs his own auth server, thus his own server cluster. Logging on to funcrusher's auth server if his servers are not set to use it is a bad thing if its going to hinder functionally. If he did edit other things then ok sure, id flip my shit too as a mod maker but then again, Tiger is kinda right. If there was that certain README.txt in the wad that told me to not edit/use stuff as a base without permission, id be GG for all of us I suppose :P

Though i digress, this thread is not all bad. Alexmax is kinda right. Having like 2 auth servers is a dangerous thing. Zandronum.com should have its own, no doubt but theres a catch22 though, how the hell would we migrate all the data/accounts over?

[ibm5155]

Project thead: "Beta Release Stupid LMS: Free for anyone to work on!"
So, everyone is free to edit but not konar? :S

[IdeIdoom]

[spoiler][/spoiler]

I think you went overboard with this one. Maybe you should've done Zandronum's auth server instead of Funcrusher to begin with since everyone can use that. Unless you want some controversial shit like this thread.

Most people that play on GV will probably remain there, so I don't see a problem with Konar's patch. Oh and now I just noticed you edited your post to include "No you can't edit my wad without permission" in the FAQ.

[mifu]

[spoiler][/spoiler]

I think you went overboard with this one. Maybe you should've done Zandronum's auth server instead of Funcrusher to begin with since everyone can use that. Unless you want some controversial shit like this thread.

Most people that play on GV will probably remain there, so I don't see a problem with Konar's patch. Oh and now I just noticed you edited your post to include "No you can't edit my wad without permission" in the FAQ.

except zandronum does not have an auth server yet

[Dark-Assassin]

Quickly, set it up

[ZZYZX]

Cat, calm down with the autism please. Why should Konar6 host a mod that tells everyone to use third party auth server instead of his own local auth server?
Or perhaps Grandvoid should switch to Funcrusher auth server so your mod works without altering the message?

You shouldn't have included any hostnames in your mod in the first place. That should be done with MOTD setting on the server.
Just think of Hypnotoad's ELO duel mod, which uses account system yet does NOT tell you to go to any specific auth server to register, instead servers have this written in MOTD.
Note that Hypnotoad is a GV admin.

@Dusk I don't see the problem in hard-coding a log message that tells people to go to a reliable auth server. It is my mod after all - which I eventually plan on hosting myself.

Then you should have outright forbidden to host it anywhere except Funcrusher. Right now the hardcoded message would just mislead everyone as Grandvoid is using own auth server since forever (for JM, mostly) and registering at Funcrusher wouldn't help. Not only it wouldn't work, but also Konar would have a mod which basically refers to and advertises Grandvoid's competitor. That's just shitty of you.

That, and you only show your shitfullness further by trying to make Konar look bad by bringing up various history examples of him misadministrating.

ALSO
Adding a patch PK3 is NOT editing, this practice is widely used to avoid actually modifying original files.
And you can't really forbid that unless somewhere in your resources it says that one can not make stuff based on ILMS.
But then again you will simply block even legit addons that way.

ALSO
I believe scripts can be overwritten if there are say two scripts 180. And you can't prohibit that one. Just can't. Because one log message isn't "based on your work".

[Cyber']

Konar6 - The "easier" way to do it would be to use "ACS_Terminate" to remove the original script, then simply type whatever you feel like in an alternate "log" script.....

Or rename "log" to "print / hudmessage"....either one works.

[Combinebobnt]

Cyber actually has the best solution, override the script with an extra wad and the problem is solved and no wad is edited!

[Catastrophe]

Project thead: "Beta Release Stupid LMS: Free for anyone to work on!"
So, everyone is free to edit but not konar? :S

They're two different mods. Idiotic LMS will be free to work on as well once I've had my fun.

Though i digress, this thread is not all bad. Alexmax is kinda right. Having like 2 auth servers is a dangerous thing. Zandronum.com should have its own, no doubt but theres a catch22 though, how the hell would we migrate all the data/accounts over?

Just migrate whichever auth server has the most registered users. I don't mind if my mod has to be entirely reset if it ends up not being Funcrusher.

Just think of Hypnotoad's ELO duel mod, which uses account system yet does NOT tell you to go to any specific auth server to register, instead servers have this written in MOTD.
Note that Hypnotoad is a GV admin.

I'm sorry about whatever dream-land you're in but in an active 40+ player server that simply does not work. Having a built-in command that explains all the steps is the only way to go. I'd rather not have to hard-code a motd.

ALSO
Adding a patch PK3 is NOT editing, this practice is widely used to avoid actually modifying original files.
And you can't really forbid that unless somewhere in your resources it says that one can not make stuff based on ILMS.
But then again you will simply block even legit addons that way.

As I've said multiple times, he took an entire acs file out. He is not simply "overriding" anything.

Konar6 - The "easier" way to do it would be to use "ACS_Terminate" to remove the original script, then simply type whatever you feel like in an alternate "log" script.....

Or rename "log" to "print / hudmessage"....either one works.

Had he done this instead of taking an entire acs file out of my project, I would not have cared.

[AlexMax]

Maybe you should've done Zandronum's auth server instead of Funcrusher to begin with since everyone can use that.

Servers can use any given auth server they choose right now. There's no reason why I couldn't use Grandvoid's, or Konar uses mine. The reason I personally use mine is so if there's a problem with it, I have easy access to crash dumps and I can fix it myself (which makes sense, since I'm the one who wrote it).

I'm not sure why everybody else thought it was a good idea to host their own, frankly.

[Mobius]

I'm not sure why everybody else thought it was a good idea to host their own, frankly.

Then why make it open source?

[AlexMax]

Then why make it open source?

The whole reason the auth server was made open source was threefold:

1. To hedge against Zandronum becoming another ZDaemon
2. To allow outside contributions easier.
3. To allow people to run their own local auth servers for testing login-related functionality.

I'm not angry at other people setting up auth servers - I think that I even helped them set theirs up at the time. Didn't necessarily think it was a good idea, but I thought it was harmless at least. It was shortly after when I realized that people were asking me questions about their account, why they had to sign up at multiple places, and how to reset their account password when Konar hadn't set up e-mail or given anybody else enough access to reset account passwords that I thought that maybe having multiple login servers wasn't the best idea.

Also, when I was developing it, I had figured that eventually there would be an official zandronum.com account server and everybody would eventually use that I didn't realize until later that merging accounts from the three login servers might be tricky, and that there was no guarantee that the server admins would switch.

Also, having other login servers out there puts me in a tight spot in terms of support - if I make changes to the auth server that makes it difficult to upgrade (say, chances to the database schema), where does that leave Konar and Jenova?

Perhaps I should have held off on releasing the source until it was in a more complete state than it is today, or maybe even waited until the official zandronum.com login server was up, so server admins wouldn't feel the need to set their own up unless something went wrong - but hindsight is 20/20.

[ZZYZX]

I'm sorry about whatever dream-land you're in but in an active 40+ player server that simply does not work. Having a built-in command that explains all the steps is the only way to go. I'd rather not have to hard-code a motd.

You can view MOTD at any time by typing "motd" which is essentially a built-in command that explains all the steps (if configured properly, of course).