ConsoleCommand discussion

[AlexMax]

I agree with the anti-ConsoleCommand sentiments expressed in this thread. ACS and DECORATE is already a difficult-enough thing to to keep consistent between versions, the existence of ConsoleCommand now means that the console language, cvar/ccmd names, cvar/ccmd behavior, must remain consistent between versions as well.

And this console language that must remain consistent between versions in order to keep compatibility with ConsoleCommand...I've managed to crash Zandronum through futzing around with various string escaping corner-cases. And anybody who knows computer security knows that where there is a crash, there is also probably a security flaw. But fixing the problem would break ConsoleCommand compatibility, by definition.

Remove ConsoleCommand and I will abandon Zandronum. It's literally the only reason I stay here.

Tough talk. Where would you go, ZDoom? GZDoom? Odamex? ZDaemon? Eternity Engine? None of those ports offer "ConsoleCommand" either.

[Ijon Tichy]

Remove ConsoleCommand and I will abandon Zandronum. It's literally the only reason I stay here.

Tough talk. Where would you go, ZDoom? GZDoom? Odamex? ZDaemon? Eternity Engine? None of those ports offer "ConsoleCommand" either.

I'd probably go and do independent game and application development. Removing the functionality ConsoleCommand gives would cripple many of the mods I've made (every mod in my signature would be crippled), and if that happens, why stay? Plus, you can't put Doom mods on a resume, anyway.

edit: http://zandronum.com/tracker/view.php?id=1070#c5987

[Watermelon]

I think the features it's used for should be added to ACS (like get/setCVar) which can be controlled to prevent flooding of the hard drive, among anything else.

[jwaffe]

Can you start endless logfiles with ConsoleCommand()? If so, that's one to be added to the list.

OFF:
EDIT - got a strange database error on the forum when I edited this post, I wasn't able to reproduce it. (something involving "out of disk space")

EDIT2- apparently I'm not the only one the forum is bugging out for, either, there were some posts in the BE topic that seemed to indicate strange behavior

[ibm5155]

I never used consolecommand and I don´t see a real use of it, should be fov?
can I have a good example of what I couldn´t do in acs/decorate that I only can do with consolecommand?

In the worst case It could be limited only offline the consolecommand...

[Catastrophe]

I never used consolecommand and I don´t see a real use of it, should be fov?
can I have a good example of what I couldn´t do in acs/decorate that I only can do with consolecommand?

In the worst case It could be limited only offline the consolecommand...

I see you haven't read anything on this thread. Also, saving variables.

[-Jes-]

I have to agree, ConsoleCommand is far too necessary for many mods to pull it without having any form of (secure) replacement for it.

[Watermelon]

So far I think we should list all the things people use ConsoleCommand for, and see if each can have a viable ACS counterpart substitution.
Off the top of my head:
- Puking clientside scripts always (equivalent of "puke -123")
- Saving data to a CVar (SetCvar(str name, int value);)
- Get String and float (GetCVarString(str cvar); GetCVarFloat(str cvar);) where getCVarFloat returns a fixed point approximate value

[Ænima]

So far I think we should list all the things people use ConsoleCommand for, and see if each can have a viable ACS counterpart substitution.
Off the top of my head:
- Puking clientside scripts always (equivalent of "puke -123")
- Saving data to a CVar (SetCvar(str name, int value);)
- Get String and float (GetCVarString(str cvar); GetCVarFloat(str cvar);) where getCVarFloat returns a fixed point approximate value

-forcing hud_scale 0 or 1 on a client for that particular session, whichever the mod requires
-forcing compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on, on the server side (Mercenaries requires it to be enabled, otherwise the buy menu won't work)

[one_Two]

Forcing aspect ratio?I dunno. Also some wads use cc say and team say in cutscenes, I think jumpmaze does, I'm not sure.

[Konar6]

Are we listing just any use of ConsoleCommand, or only that for which there is no obvious replacement. Like forcing compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on, on the server can be done simply in text file for the wad - "note: this mod needs compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on", and say in cutscenes can be replaced by hudmessage, I guess? I would like to see the list of what ConsoleCommand is REALLY necessary for, so we could then request viable and safe ACS replacement.

[Catastrophe]

It'd be nice if there was a setdmflags, or setcompatflags options or something.

[Ænima]

Are we listing just any use of ConsoleCommand, or only that for which there is no obvious replacement. Like forcing compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on, on the server can be done simply in text file for the wad - "note: this mod needs compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on"

I'd rather have it be as automatic as possible.

It'd be nice if there was a setdmflags, or setcompatflags options or something.

Something like this^ would help.

[Ijon Tichy]

Are we listing just any use of ConsoleCommand, or only that for which there is no obvious replacement. Like forcing compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on, on the server can be done simply in text file for the wad - "note: this mod needs compat_clientssendfullbuttoninfo on", and say in cutscenes can be replaced by hudmessage, I guess? I would like to see the list of what ConsoleCommand is REALLY necessary for, so we could then request viable and safe ACS replacement.

A. Determining what ConsoleCommand is used for has been happening on the bugtracker entry
B. WADs gotten through WADseeker/GetWAD do not come with text files, and places like BE don't even have a place for the READMEs
C. Only one in maybe fifty people ever actually read the README anyway
D. as AEnima said, it's a lot more convenient to have it done automatically for you

[Konar6]

Just a correction on B, Ijon: wads (zips) gotten from Wadseeker and GetWAD do come with text files. But the file must be properly packed for wad tools to extract them. The zip file, the wad and the txt file inside must all have the exact same name.

C: ok? Those who don't read it, do read the project forum thread. And if neither - well they'll notice that their config is not right when it's not working, just like you notice it when you run AOW as Survival.

[Theshooter7]

Code: Select all

Script 408 Open
{
	if(GetCVar("wdi_disable_autoconfig") == True) Terminate;
	While(1)
	{
		if(getcvar("sv_respawnsuper") == False) Consolecommand("sv_respawnsuper true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_loseammo") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_loseammo true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_losepowerups") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_losepowerups true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_losearmor") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_losearmor true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_loseweapons") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_loseweapons true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_losekeys") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_losekeys true");
		if(getcvar("sv_coop_loseinventory") == False) Consolecommand("sv_coop_loseinventory true");
		if(getcvar("sv_forcegldefaults") == False) Consolecommand("sv_forcegldefaults true");
		if(getcvar("sv_disallowspying") == False) Consolecommand("sv_disallowspying true");
		if(getcvar("sv_disallowsuicide") == False) Consolecommand("sv_disallowsuicide true");
		if(getcvar("sv_noautomapallies") == False) Consolecommand("sv_noautomapallies true");
		if(getcvar("sv_noidentifytarget") == False) Consolecommand("sv_noidentifytarget true");
		if(getcvar("sv_randomcoopstarts") == False) Consolecommand("sv_randomcoopstarts true");
		if(getcvar("sv_nocoopinfo") == False) Consolecommand("sv_nocoopinfo true");
		if(getcvar("sv_weapondrop") == True) Consolecommand("sv_weapondrop false");
		
		if(getcvar("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings") == False && WDI_GameState() != GAMESTATE_GAMEOVER) Consolecommand("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings true");
		else if(getcvar("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings") == True && WDI_GameState() == GAMESTATE_GAMEOVER) Consolecommand("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings false");
		
		if(getcvar("compat_limited_airmovement") == False) Consolecommand("compat_limited_airmovement true");
		if(getcvar("compat_nocrosshair") == False) Consolecommand("compat_nocrosshair true");
		
		Delay(1);
	}
	Delay(1);
}

This code automatically sets up appropriate DMFlags etc for the server in WDI. As you can see, it's not NECESSARY (in fact, the server owner can even disable it with a custom cvar), but it's nice to have.

One thing that is necessary, and extremely useful, however, are these two lines from the above code:

Code: Select all

	if(getcvar("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings") == False && WDI_GameState() != GAMESTATE_GAMEOVER) Consolecommand("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings true");
		else if(getcvar("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings") == True && WDI_GameState() == GAMESTATE_GAMEOVER) Consolecommand("sv_applylmsspectatorsettings false");

These lines automatically allow players to talk to eachother after a round ends (during the tally board). Without it, dead players can't talk to players still alive. I received a lot of positive feedback when I implemented this, and it would be a shame to see it go. If there were an alternative to handle this, that would be greatly welcome!

(I'll also post this on the bug tracker to add to the discussion there)

[AlexMax]

One thing that Konar6 uses ConsoleCommand for is the DUEL32 shoot map. It is used to turn on respawning items for that particular map, and then subsequently turn it off again once the map is done.

I am also against hardcoding such settings under any conditions, however. Ideally, such a thing would be handled through server configuration. You can't overload addmap either, since DUEL32 doesn't use a maplist. How about the following new console commands:

allmapexec <command string to execute>
Always execute the given command string upon switching maps.

addmapexec <map lump> <command string to execute>
Execute the given command string upon switching to the given map. If a map has a command string already, it's overwritten.

defaultmapexec <command string to execute>
Execute the command string upon switching to a map without a command string.

clearmapexecs
Clear all mapexec's.


Points of clarification:

• Any latched cvars (i.e. cvars that normally require a restart) apply to the switched-to map.
• For a given map switch, the command string for allmapexec is always executed if it exists, and is always executed first. The addmapexec or defaultmapexec command strings, if they exist, are executed second.

[Torr Samaho]

One thing that Konar6 uses ConsoleCommand for is the DUEL32 shoot map. It is used to turn on respawning items for that particular map, and then subsequently turn it off again once the map is done.

I am also against hardcoding such settings under any conditions, however. Ideally, such a thing would be handled through server configuration. You can't overload addmap either, since DUEL32 doesn't use a maplist. How about the following new console commands:

Wouldn't it be better to handle this via MAPINFO?

[AlexMax]

Wouldn't it be better to handle this via MAPINFO?

The reason I don't enforce settings in DUEL32 is because some server administrators and players might have different opinions than me on what settings should be used. I would rather server admins be opinionated than me as a map author.

The only problem with my approach is that some maps might realistically support more than one set of settings (i.e. what if I wanted Greenwar MAP20 to support both OS and NS settings), but I'm not really sure how to expose that in a friendly way, either from a configuration POV or from a player selection POV. But this is something that is already an open problem, and I'd rather it be handled through server configuration than...say...having players press a button on the START map to toggle between skill levels, or toggle between different configurations of a map.

[NeuralStunner]

It is also my opinion that the function should be replaced with more specific dedicated function for its desired uses. This would also more cleanly weed out bad uses (as they wouldn't be implemented or usable).

Settings (DMFlags/renderer/&c.) which a map requires to work properly should be added to MapInfo.

While I to would like mod data persistence, I can see why it's a sticky problem. Ideally, saving such data is always instigated by the user, servers could use it to back up player stats and such periodically. (I imagine a scripted, "automated" version would still require user confirmation.)

On the subject of data saving and abuse, is it possible to call Autosave every tick and thrash the user's drive? Or is there a safety on this function already?