Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

Maps, modifications, add-ons, projects, and other releases for Zandronum. Also includes announcers.
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Medicris
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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v1)

#21

Post by Medicris » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:29 pm

Yeah, this is in the case of custom maps that use line specials on monster deaths that aren't readily known beforehand. It happened on Memento Mori map07 and just had to nextmap once the level master placed a manc without knowing it'd break the map.

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v1)

#22

Post by Avi » Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:33 pm

Shadowlink223 wrote: Honestly? I'd be just fine with being able to kill monsters I've put down, even if I didn't gain any mana back.
Agreed. There's nothing more frustrating than accidentally placing a monster somewhere that'd give away your rune location if you misclicked or did something else on the dumb side. I personally would love to be able to still fix those kind of mistakes.

On a side note, back when this first came out, some of us had a private set of maze maps that had an infinite spawning set of imps on an unreachable tower in the center. We intentionally have little to no monsters on the maps with an infinite mana source. I know the first thing I did when I saw this was back was try to dig up those maps and dust them off, but given the balance change, there'd really be no point at this particular moment. Any chance that you could make mana-on-kill a CVAR option for those of us that have been playing this since the beginning?
<TerminusEst13><GMOTA_Guy> enemies that go invulnerable are the worst things in the history of the universe
<TerminusEst13>:D

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Cutman
 
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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v1)

#23

Post by Cutman » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:03 pm

Shadowlink223 wrote: Honestly? I'd be just fine with being able to kill monsters I've put down, even if I didn't gain any mana back.
Really? If that is the case I am happy to add a monster remover tool for the LM's for v3.
Avi wrote:Any chance that you could make mana-on-kill a CVAR option for those of us that have been playing this since the beginning?
So you want a CVAR to bring the soul reap thing back? I think Level Masters will have too much mana though, try the new version and see what you think. Level Master is very easy to modify with patch wads now though, if you want I can make one to add the soul reaper to the Level Master's arsenal (or you could have a go at it yourself). If you just want infinite mana however, you could probably just have a PWAD replacing the Level Master's ammo actor with one that gives him 9999 or whatever.

Anyways, V2 is ready!

Should be a lot more fun to be both the Level Master and the players with these changes as it should resolve the issue of people just speedrunning the map to find the exit rune as fast as possible.

  • Maps now reset after placing the Exit Rune. This means doors will shut and moving terrain will be back to their original state when the game begins, giving the level master more time if he has opened up the map to place the Exit Rune.
  • Added a new server option: sv_randomlevelmasters. Setting it to 1 picks a new level master after he hits the winlimit. Setting it to 2 picks a new level master after each round.
  • Added Fake Exit Rune trap. It looks identical to the exit rune and disappears when touched. It fades in and out from time to time showing that it is fake.
  • Added Resurrection Trap. When triggered by a player a totem pops out the ground and starts Resurrecting fallen enemies around the trap for a few seconds.
  • To pick up the exit rune you now have to stand next to it for a few seconds to channel it's power. Moving away from the rune breaks the channel and you have to start the channelling again. While channeling you are immune to stage hazards.
  • Lost Soul now costs 6 (down from 10).
  • You can no longer spawn Arachnotrons or Mancubi on MAP07 to prevent issues where the players could not proceed.
  • Added an error message for failing to teleport to the Exit Rune.
  • Level Master increased mana rate doesn't decrease when players die.
  • The Level Master now triggers shootable lines/doors by running into them.
  • You can now prepare buffs in line of sight of players.
  • Recoil traps can be destroyed by shooting them.
  • Recoil traps do not trigger if the player is standing perfectly still.
  • Spawned monsters no longer infight.
  • Changed the default Exit Rune spawn time to 40 seconds (can still be changed with pointlimit).
  • Other internal stuff to make mod compatibility better.
Download v2
Last edited by Cutman on Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Dark-Assassin
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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#24

Post by Dark-Assassin » Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:49 pm

Cutman wrote:You can no longer spawn Arachnotrons or Mancubi on MAP07 to prevent issues where the players could not proceed.
Hmm, E1M8 should be the same for the Barons.

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#25

Post by Cutman » Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:36 pm

It doesn't support Doom though, I couldn't figure out a way for ACS to detect whether Doom or Doom 2 was being played.

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#26

Post by Arctangent » Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:45 pm

I can't help but feel that, in spite of how this presents itself as marines vs level master, the end result is actually more like an asymmetric free for all. The fact that only one player can actually win adds an interesting quality where it's actually advantageous to dispose of those who were just moments ago your allies when victory is in the clear. Though of course, you need to make sure you can actually win after shoving the other marines in a pit or something otherwise you'll have quite the egg on your face.

Probably beyond the scope of this standard edition, but it'd be interesting to see another version that adds more incentive to be selfish while making the level master powerful enough for the consequences of poorly planned selfishness to be dire. It seems like an interesting concept, where you can't trust the others yet are required to if you want to get close to winning - just make sure you have a way to keep the rune for yourself, because otherwise you might find yourself being the one blasted into a pit.

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#27

Post by Armitage » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:41 pm

Excellent to see this old treasure has been resurrected and polished for the modern reincarnation of Skulltag, I vaguely recall it from many moons ago but wasn't aware if it was widely popular or only in small circles.

With regards to optimal map sets to choose, Alien Vendetta wouldn't work well given the vast amount of levels are linear in design with few hiding places or non-linear paths to force exploration of the map and deviation from a set path, but rather boils down to players simply blasting their way through enemies in the immediate vicinity and speedrunning through sections to reach the most plausible location.

Maps which require backtracking, have nooks and crannies and a puzzling non-linear design would suit this best, two map sets which come to mind to fit this criteria are Icarus: Alien Vanguard and Memento Mori. Whilst choosing something deliberately high tier wheir simply getting through the map itself is a challenge rather then the ingenuity of the Level Master should be avoided such as Hell Revealed or Kama Sutra as an example, although I'm not entirely ruling out they could plausibly work with a high player count.

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#28

Post by Cutman » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:59 pm

Still having trouble getting a good balance for higher player counts, though I don't think it's possible because these maps were not designed for 10+ man marine deathballs. For smaller groups of players it feels just about right. I welcome more feedback and ideas on how to handle this.

Btw I see a lot of players just summoning monsters alone. The best way to guarantee kills is to abuse the traps and buffs. Dropping a tentacle trap behind a door with a strong monster behind, summoning big stealth monsters or small monsters with the might buff can catch players off guard. Basically the bigger jerk you are the more you'll win!

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RE: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#29

Post by Combinebobnt » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:54 pm

There is a bug where sometimes before the exit rune is placed, monsters will target the level master or a player, and the players' invulnerability doesn't always work, so we've had a few player deaths before the round even begins with the exit rune placed.

How about making the tentacle trap shootable? It can make monster closet/key/teleport traps impossible sometimes for its cheap cost.

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Re: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#30

Post by Cutman » Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:57 am

I see you already made a patch to do this, I'm happy to add this to the main file assuming it's actually working correctly.

I was thinking of updating it to add a bunch of CVARS to customize the game even further. Also any additional ideas to make it fun/balanced are welcome, it seems people get fed up with it after a few rounds (possibly unavoidable).

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Re: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#31

Post by Combinebobnt » Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:01 pm

bump

I worked on said patch recently https://static.allfearthesentinel.net/w ... uff-v8.pk3 . I didn't put a changelog in it because uh idk ???
Added:
  • Finally fixed that friggin bug where players can die before the rune is placed because setplayerproperty()'s invuln just gives you a 30 second invuln sphere, so if you set pointlimit 30> bad things can happen (deaths). There is a least 1 tic before monsters are notarget'ed, so any infront of spawn will wake up usually. The solution was to just use setactorproperty() instead.
  • Surrounding teleport destinations with monsters was one of my super cheese unfair strategies, so I made it so the LM can't place anything near teleport destinations, with a decently large radius.
  • Made it much more difficult to bypass the LM spawn sight check
  • Made the slow trap shootable as well as the chain
  • Health + armor can't respawn, so players won't run out of ammo (LM has infinite over time)
  • + the other small things I did, mostly to help the players out
I made a doom1 version a while ago too, but its probably not as fun as doom2 (and now out of date probs).

Other stuff I've noticed over uh I guess the last few years lol:
  • It's surprising how difficult this gamemode can get. Even plutonia is borderline too difficult for ~4 players sometimes. Most of it is the pressure knowing that if the players don't speedrun, they are probably going to meet a cyberdemon.
  • For some reason I thought the monster powerups were very OP, but you balanced them nicely.
  • The cvar for levelmaster ownership transfer broke with some update of zandronum, but the default is my favorite: where the LM keeps it if they win, and any player who wins gets LM next round. The winning player getting LM next round is the best part, because it encourages an unfriendly cooperation among them to get the rune. Games that were 'won' by the players would be lost because they would shoot eachother off the rune and into teles and stuff, and then the LM can sneak a last minute cyberdemon or something and pull a BS win lol. They have to fight both the LM and eachother for the rune :happyface: . Only downside I see is if the LM wins too many times in a row (like me heheh), the poor doom marines getting savaged might want someone else as LM.
There is a rare bug where the LM can pick up and shoot guns. I also wanted to add a global rune pickup percentage for all players to see, esp the LM. I haven't really tried LM with non-vanilla content yet either.

I'm semi-interested in getting these changes into the main file, so let me know any plan. It seems I spend alot of effort modifying others' wads I come across for multiplay.

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Re: Level Master: Remastered! (v2)

#32

Post by Cutman » Thu Apr 16, 2020 2:08 pm

It's been a long time since I've touched this, so you've probably got a better understanding of how it all works now. You have my permission to make your own main file and distribute it, as I have other projects I want to focus on. I would suggest giving it it's own spinoff name but since LM isn't exactly popular (as far as I know), it's fine to just keep the name.

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